German Flag ??? Loberich 1

Discussion in 'Axis Units' started by 40th Alabama, Dec 25, 2006.

  1. 40th Alabama

    40th Alabama Member

    I have a flag which is red with a white swastika encirled by a gear. The flag is square, about 4' on a side with silver tassles along three sides. It has on the top silver rings. In the upper left hand corner is a leather insert approximately 6" x 8" with the word Loberich 1 inscribed. Does anyone have any idea if this is a regimental flag or what it might be?

    Thanks for your help.
     
  2. David Layne

    David Layne Well-Known Member

    I have a flag which is red with a white swastika encirled by a gear. The flag is square, about 4' on a side with silver tassles along three sides. It has on the top silver rings. In the upper left hand corner is a leather insert approximately 6" x 8" with the word Loberich 1 inscribed. Does anyone have any idea if this is a regimental flag or what it might be?

    Thanks for your help.


    No. But glad someone else from Alabama is posting here.
     
  3. Kyt

    Kyt Very Senior Member

  4. David Layne

    David Layne Well-Known Member

    Hi

    Have a look at this site and let us know whether it looks similar to this - it's the closest flag that I can think of to the one that you've described (but the colours are slightly different)

    German Labour Front (NSDAP, Germany)


    This one?
     

    Attached Files:

  5. Kyt

    Kyt Very Senior Member

    Yep David, that's the only German Nazi era flag with cogs that I could think of - having said that a war-time occupied -european fascist party might have had a variation of that.

    Bloody hell, that's a messy sentence!!
     
  6. 40th Alabama

    40th Alabama Member

    That is pretty close, with the exception of the colors and the flag was aparently designed to be suspended from the top. I'll do some research now on NSDAP and see what I can learn.

    Thanks so much for your help.

    David,
    I was born and grew up in Alabama. Am now in the Stone Mountain area of Georgia. The 40th Alabama was my g Grandfather's (Pvt, Co. B ) and my g Uncle's (Capt, Co. I) Regiment during the War of Northern Agression.
     
  7. Wise1

    Wise1 There We Are Then

    Dont think its the NSDAP in particular you want to research, try the NSFO
     
  8. Kyt

    Kyt Very Senior Member

    That is pretty close, with the exception of the colors and the flag was aparently designed to be suspended from the top. I'll do some research now on NSDAP and see what I can learn.

    Have had a look at a lot of DAF (Deutsche Arbeitsfront - German Labour Front) pictures on the web, and they really don't seem fussy about the clour schemes. As long as the swastika and cog are there, then I've seen black, white and red ones. However, not the one that you've got.

    As to hanging fromthe top, that just means that it's a banner instead of a flag.
     
  9. Shörner

    Shörner Member

    Ive found several sites reffering to the Loberichs, a family in Germany.
     
  10. Kiwiwriter

    Kiwiwriter Very Senior Member

    I think that's an NSKK banner. That was the Hitler Youth Motor Corps, which trained HJ kids to drive vehicles. The gears suggest that to me.

    It might also be the Deutsche Arbeits Front, the DAF, which replaced the trade unions, when Hitler had them shut down and their leadership put in concentration camps.
     
  11. Kyt

    Kyt Very Senior Member

    The NSKK flags were different - no cogs:

    NSKK-Motor-Obergruppe

    [​IMG]
     
  12. Kiwiwriter

    Kiwiwriter Very Senior Member

    What about the RAD?
     
  13. Kyt

    Kyt Very Senior Member

    RAD Section Flag

    RAD Abteilungsfahne

    [​IMG]

    Male RAD Camp Flag

    Lagerfahne des RAD/M

    [​IMG]

    Female Youth RAD Camp Flag

    Lagerfahne des RAD der weiblichen Jugend

    [​IMG]
     
  14. von Poop

    von Poop Adaministrator Admin

    DAF unit flag often carried local unit name on the top left, 'Loberich 1' would fit that.
    If the cogwheel is in gold rather than black then it would most likely be a flag for 'exemplary National socialist Factories' given out for self-explanatory reasons.
    The cogwheel was mostly/mainly used by the DAF but is also seen in a variety of other Nazi organisations symbolism as an accepted part of their 'graphical dictionary'.
    Volkswagen:
    [​IMG]
    I'd also make some issue with describing the NSKK as a purely HJ/DJ organisation, since 1930 the NSAK/NSKK provided a valuable group of keen driver/mechanics aged from 18-45 to the Germans, they used many Non-German personnel from occupied countries. One specific branch, the 'Motor HJ' ensured the training of kids, the majority were adult motoring enthusiasts.

    Cheers,
    Adam.
     
  15. Kyt

    Kyt Very Senior Member

    I'd also make some issue with describing the NSKK as a purely HJ/DJ organisation, since 1930 the NSAK/NSKK provided a valuable group of keen driver/mechanics aged from 18-45 to the Germans, they used many Non-German personnel from occupied countries. One specific branch, the 'Motor HJ' ensured the training of kids, the majority were adult motoring enthusiasts.

    Cheers,
    Adam.

    From:

    Axis History Factbook: History of the NSKK

    "History of the NSKK

    The history of the Nationalsozialistisches Kraftfahrkorps (NSKK) began 1 Apr 1930 when the Nationalsozialistisches Automobil Korps (NSAK) was founded on the order of Martin Bormann. It was founded to organize all NSDAP-members who owned a car or motorcycle in a single nation-wide unit. The SturmAbteilung (SA) had organized these since 1928 in Kraftfahrstaffeln but these were poorly organized.
    When the NSAK was formed the Kraftfahrstaffeln were not transferred to the NSAK but were reorganized as the Motor-SA. The members of Motor-SA were however automatically members of the NSAK, but not reverse. All commanders of NSAK were SA-officers but most of the regular members were not.
    SA-Gruppenführer Adolf Hühnlein was made commander of the NSAK and suggested renaming it to the NSKK and this was accepted by SA-leader Ernst Röhm who was in the process of reorganizing the SA.

    When Adolf Hitler became chancellor in 1933 the NSKK expanded rapidly to 30.000 members. After Röhm and the SA-leadership were murdered during the Night of long knives (30 June 1934) the Motor-SA became a part of the NSKK and it was made an independent organization.
    The NSKK took over all German motorclubs Sep 1933 and expanded to 350.000 members.
    After Austria was made a part of Germany Mar 1938 the NSKK expanded to over 500.000 members.

    In 27 Jan 1939 the NSKK was made responsible for the training of drivers for the army in the NSKK Motor Sports Schools. When the war broke out the NSKK provided transports for the construction of the Siegfried Line (the defenses along the western border), assisted in traffic control, resettlement of Volksdeutsche from Soviet-controlled areas (in cooperation with the SchutzStaffel (SS) in the NSKK Kommando Volksdeutsche Mittelstelle), pre- and postmilitary training, assisting the armed forces with transport etc.
    When Adolf Hühnlein died in June 1942 the was replaced by NSKK-Obergruppenführer Erwin Kraus."

    Apart from the technical perspective, it was seems to another example of the Nazi's subsuming different "independent" organisations into one single entity controlled by them.
     
  16. Kyt

    Kyt Very Senior Member

    The cogwheel was mostly/mainly used by the DAF but is also seen in a variety of other Nazi organisations symbolism as an accepted part of their 'graphical dictionary'.
    Volkswagen:



    VP, any examples, as I haven't come across any other organisations with the cog that weren't DAF or linked to DAF (the VW symbol seems to be an example of DAF representation at VW)?

    Cheers
    K
     
  17. von Poop

    von Poop Adaministrator Admin

    Eg: Technische Nothilfe or TeNo:
    [​IMG]
    There were also some trade and shoulder strap badges, in the case of the shoulder strap it was used to denote 'technical'.
    I don't think this badge:
    [​IMG]
    Is specifically RAD either(?).
    Dig about and there's quite a few.

    My sister bought me the rather strange 'Flags of the Third Reich' by Brian Davis a while back, I laughed at first but it's actually fascinating on the design, political control & manufacture of Nazi flags and banners. Say what you like about the Nazi's but it can't be denied that their imagery had a certain 30's stylishness.
     
  18. Owen

    Owen -- --- -.. MOD

    Say what you like about the Nazi's but it can't be denied that their imagery had a certain 30's stylishness.


    I agree both soviet and nazi iconography was fantastic.
    Design at it's best, just what it stood for was $*@*.
     
  19. Kyt

    Kyt Very Senior Member

    Cheers VP - will now have to rethink earlier responses (bugger).

    I don't think this badge:
    [​IMG]
    Is specifically RAD either(?).


    Looks remarkably like the Royal Pioneers Corps:

    [​IMG]
     
  20. P51fan

    P51fan Junior Member

    Does anyone know what happened to many of the party standards and flags we see in alot of the old Nazi newsreels? I understood from one source that Stalin ordered them all burned in the streets of Berlin. I've also heard that many are on display in the war museums in Moscow and some are on display in the Imperial War Museum in London. I have for years been interested in flags and was curious if any survived.

    By the way I really enjoy reading the many excellent posts and sharing what "little' I know and am finding out.

    http://re3.mm-a7.yimg.com/image/3827586452
     

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