George Williams Service Records

Discussion in 'Service Records' started by Emjsw01, May 18, 2019.

  1. Emjsw01

    Emjsw01 Member


    I am new to the site (and military history!) but I am researching my family tree. My grampa told me little bits here and there about the war (like bits about being in Egypt and being 'naughty' so he was made to be a military police for a bit and going though ancient tunnels in Jerusalem) but I didn't know much about where he actually was and what he actually did. My nanna (his wife) is 92 and I wanted to be able to tell her a bit more and was hoping I could maybe ask people on here who are likely to have infinitely more experience than I, for a bit of help please? She is interested to know more and ordered his service history but some of the writing is hard to work out and there are lots of numbers and letters that I don't understand. We knew he was a pow and was forced to work in a factory (Herman Goering’s Benzene Fabrike). He was only 6 st when he came back. The best thing he ever saw was the white cliffs of Dover from a Lancaster bomber! He was in Stalag 8c amongst others, 8c is in his memoirs but not his service record (although the Stalag in his service records were a base to be shipped to other places to 'work' from). He escaped from one of them to get to Prague but he got caught near the Charles Bridge. There seems to be alot more info as to where he was and when in his records.
    I just wondered if someone might be kind enough to give us a bit of an over view as to what this is all about please?
    Best wishes Emma

    Ps I am going to have to upload a few pages at a time as all 12 pages together are too large. Please bear with me!

    Next attachment


    Last one!

    Attached Files:

    Last edited by a moderator: May 18, 2019
  2. Tricky Dicky

    Tricky Dicky Don'tre member

    You can add more than 1 image to a post, just keep selecting a file to download

    UK, British Prisoners of War, 1939-1945
    Name: G Williams
    Rank: Bombardier
    Army Number: 1471756
    Regiment: Royal Artillery
    POW Number: 262492
    Camp Type: Stalag
    Camp Number: IV-C
    Camp Location: Bystrice, Czech Republic
    Record Office: Royal Artillery (Light Anti-Aircraft) Record Office, Ibex House, The Minories, London, EC3
    Record Office Number: 6


    The above shows that at the time the Int'l Red Cross made an inspection he was in Stalag 4 C
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  3. Owen

    Owen -- --- -.. MOD

    I've merged the posts into 1.
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  4. Emjsw01

    Emjsw01 Member

    Thank you very much, that is really helpful. I am trying to follow his movements on a map and am trying to find out what each Stalag did (some seemed to keep people to work on farms and others factories etc) so this info is really helpful.
  5. Emjsw01

    Emjsw01 Member

    Thank you, I am so sorry. I use another site called roots chat for other genealogy stuff and you can only upload tiny files one at a time. When I scanned 4 pages per pdf it said the file was too big so didn't think I could post more than 1 3 page pdf. Good to know for next time. Thank you.
  6. Tullybrone

    Tullybrone Senior Member

    Hi Emma,

    If you set your alarm clock early on Monday morning and use this link you should be able to apply to Red Cross for copies of your grandfather’s POW papers.

    Requests for information about people held during Spanish Civil War or the Second World War: Quarterly limit reached

    Just check the link at 8am U.K. time and the application form should pop up - if not check it every 30 minutes until it pops up. You need to be quick off the mark as ICRC can only process a limited number of applications and past experience suggests the application form will be withdrawn by mid morning.

    It is a free service and it takes ICRC about 4 months to post copies of his papers out to you.

    Good Luck



    A shot in the dark but the redacted portions of his record might be due to the redacted entries containing medical information. It is MOD policy not to release medical inormation.
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  7. 51highland

    51highland Very Senior Member

    George Williams from find my past;

    Attached Files:

    CL1, Medwyn Edwards, Emjsw01 and 2 others like this.
  8. Incredibledisc

    Incredibledisc Well-Known Member

    Ok, I can pick out a few easy bits - he was awarded the 1939-45 campaign star, Africa Star with 8th Army Clasp, War medal and Defence Medal. There is something else in the medals section but I can’t make it out on my phone screen.
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  9. Tullybrone

    Tullybrone Senior Member


    On the same line as 39/45 Star entry I can make out “6 Mil Dis Camp Unit” preceded by - in same handwriting - PII 3/46. I interpret that entry as his award was recorded on the Part 2 Order when he was on the strength of Number 6 Military Disembarkation Unit at Strensall Barracks, York.

    DEMOBILIZATION CENTRE. (Hansard, 17 October 1945)

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  10. Incredibledisc

    Incredibledisc Well-Known Member

    That’s the bit I couldn’t decipher. Thanks Steve.
  11. Emjsw01

    Emjsw01 Member

    Hi, thank you very much, I had no idea they kept records and will definitely set my alarm early on Monday to try and fill in the form for the documents.
    Thanks for the heads up :)
  12. Emjsw01

    Emjsw01 Member

    Thanks so much for these documents, they are really helpful. I appreciate your time and effort :)
  13. Emjsw01

    Emjsw01 Member

    Thank you, having looked these medals up I have been able to learn a bit more about my Grampa. I appreciate you having looked over the records and for letting me know, that is great :)
  14. Emjsw01

    Emjsw01 Member

  15. Tullybrone

    Tullybrone Senior Member

    Thanks Emma.

    Have you still got some more MOD forms to post? You mention you have 12 but I can only see you’ve posted 4?

    The most helpful form from which to track a soldiers movements and service history is the B103 form - there are often several of them.

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  16. Emjsw01

    Emjsw01 Member

    Hi Steve,
    Thank you for taking a look. I will go back and check the pdfs, there were 12 pages in total so I made 4 pdfs which should have had 3 pages per pdf but I could well have made a mistake. The mod did send more like his attestation papers from when he joined the ta under age!
    I will go and look for B103 and will post it when I find it.
    Thank you very much :)
  17. Emjsw01

    Emjsw01 Member

    Thank you for deciphering that and for the link about the camps, it is really helpful to try and piece his time in the army bit by bit.
    I have really struggled with some of the writing on this form especially the tall, narrow spidery writing (mind you all of it is much neater than mine!!).
    Thanks for your help, I really appreciate it.
  18. Steve Mac

    Steve Mac Very Senior Member

    Hello Emma,

    Your grampa served with various LAA Regiments, Royal Artillery. LAA = Light Anti-Aircraft.

    He attested on 6 June 1939 and was posted to 57 LAA.
    On 31 August 1939 he was posted to 53 LAA.
    On 28 November 1939 he was posted to 69 AA.
    On 23 January 1940 he was posted to 22 LAA.
    On 26 October 1940 he was posted to 45 LAA.
    On 7 August 1941 he was posted to 212 LAA Training Regiment.
    On 3 January 1943 he is appointed P/L/BDR (Paid Lance Bombardier) and reported as with 2/1 LAA.
    On 3 October 1943 he is posted missing on Kos, later reported PoW.
    On 24 May 1945 he arrives back in the UK liberated.

    The record does not reveal when he was posted to 2/1 LAA. However, he was stationed in the UK until 20 May 1942 and is then overseas with MEF (Middle East Forces) until 2 October 1943, so the 2/1 LAA posting likely coincides with him going overseas (but not necessarily).

    He is shown as a PoW in Germany from 3 October 1943 to 23 May 1945.

    Some background on the action on Kos here: Battle of Kos - Wikipedia

    Hope this helps...!


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  19. Emjsw01

    Emjsw01 Member

    Thank you Steve,

    That is really helpful as now I can look into what each of the LAA were doing around these dates. I am beginning to get a better picture as to what he was doing and when.
    Thanks also for the wiki page about the battle of Kos, it was great to read about what happened.
    I didn't know this before but my nan told me grampa had said that he and the men with him buried their guns near to where the modern Kos airport is now, he said they were betrayed by a man who they thought was a friendly Greek who brought them bread but it turned out he was German! He also said about 1,500 English were captured but by the time they got to the camp there was only about a 1/3 of that which seems to tie in with the numbers reported in that wiki article.
    I really appreciate you writing all of that out for me and helping to make the documents we were sent clearer.
    Thank you so much
    Best wishes Em
  20. Steve Mac

    Steve Mac Very Senior Member

    No worries, Emma. It was either that or watch Eurovision... No contest (pun intended)!

    By coincidence, I was working in Prague last week and crossed the Charles Bridge a couple of times. I liberated a couple of Porter Beers on the first occasion too. A better trip for me than it was for your grampa I think?!

    Enjoy the voyage of discovery. You should seek-out books on the Kos fiasco + his MoD Liberation Report (assuming he completed one) and any Red Cross information. There are a few forum members who copy liberation reports (at Kew) for a small fee.



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