Folding Trolley Airborne used by Parachute Regiment 1944

Discussion in 'Weapons, Technology & Equipment' started by COMMANDO, Aug 22, 2020.

  1. COMMANDO

    COMMANDO Senior Member

    Can some one help, how many folded Airborne trolleys were used by an Parachute Battalion in 1944?
    Please note I am speaking of a folded trolley, not the handcarts being used bij Airlanding units or Stretcher Trolleys as being used by RAMC..


    -How many were used in a forinstance an Mortar Platoon, a MMG Platoon?
    -How much load (kilo or lb) could one such trolley carry?

    Thanks in advance!
     
  2. Aixman

    Aixman WE addict Patron

    No mention of "folded Airborne trolleys" in the relevant War Establishments for
    "Parachute Battalion (1944)"
    I/241/1, effective 28.02.1944, and
    I/241/2, effective 15.03.1945.

    Gary Kennedy will surely know some facts.
     
  3. COMMANDO

    COMMANDO Senior Member

    Thank you Aixman !

    War Establihment details doesnt seem to fit as it says that a Parachute Battalion had by then (1944) TWO mortars platoons (4 mortars each) and as we know from the Parachute Battalions at Arnhem that they had oly ONE Mortar Platoon... I believe, just as with a normal Infantry Battalion they had 3 sections with each 2 mortars ... (Pre-1944 they had 10 mortar)
     
  4. Gary Kennedy

    Gary Kennedy Member

    Sadly I can't live up to the build-up! (Hope you're well Wolfgang).

    That type of equipment would likely be on the G.1098 equipment table. The closest I've seen is for a Canadian Parachute Battalion circa 1943, which mentions their other transport but lists nothing for trolleys. Re the WE, the Feb44 table did show two 3-in Mortar Platoons, with the option for one to be re-equipped with four Vickers MMGs in place of the four 3-in mortars. From memory every Para Bn exercised that option so fielded four 3-in mortars and four MMGs.

    Gary
     
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  5. COMMANDO

    COMMANDO Senior Member

    Thank you Gary! I think you solved the question, 1Mortar Platoon and 1 MMG (instead of a second Mortar Platoon). That seems logic.
    I also come more ore less to the conclusion that they had only 4 Mortar (and one spare mortar) .. and 4 trolleys (so each mortar 1 trolley).

    There is a difference with the number of Sergeants as each Detachment was led by a Sergeant, 2nd inc a Cpl and 6 OR...
    3 men carried the mortar while the remaining 3 carried the ammo on the trolly.

    Additional they had possibly also an Platoon Sergeant.
    What rank had an rangfinder?
     
  6. JimHerriot

    JimHerriot Ready for Anything

    For COMMANDO, Gary K, Aixman, and all.

    A container load out manifest/table (by aircraft) for Market Garden, if such still exists and if it goes into the fine detail too (big "ifs" unfortunately) it may possibly help with things.

    Also, it may be worth having a hunt around, possibly, for reference to "barrow" as well as "trolley" (see extracts below from John Weeks "Airborne Equipment - A History of it's Development" published 1976) some text followed by photo from an exercise (IWM photo, unfortunately no IWM reference number within John Weeks book).

    Given John Weeks service and connection with Airborne forces I'm hoping the use of "barrow' was more than his alone.

    Good luck with the hunt.

    Kind regards, always,

    Jim.

    Trolley Barrow TEXT.jpg

    Trolley Barrow.jpg
     
    Last edited: Aug 27, 2020
  7. JimHerriot

    JimHerriot Ready for Anything

    P.S.

    As an aside, Cee posted an excellent photo of a RE container/trolley/barrow load out in the thread here:

    Folding Trolley - Airborne?

    Kind regards, always,

    Jim.
     
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  8. COMMANDO

    COMMANDO Senior Member

    The trolley was in 1942 droppel by container but by 1944 it was dropped on its own by making use of an type D apparatus
     
    Last edited: Aug 29, 2020
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  9. COMMANDO

    COMMANDO Senior Member

    From RAF Airborne Forces Manual
     

    Attached Files:

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  10. COMMANDO

    COMMANDO Senior Member

    From IWM
     

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  11. COMMANDO

    COMMANDO Senior Member

    IWM Photo
     

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  12. COMMANDO

    COMMANDO Senior Member

    IWM
     

    Attached Files:

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  13. COMMANDO

    COMMANDO Senior Member

    IWM
     

    Attached Files:

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  14. COMMANDO

    COMMANDO Senior Member

    IWM
     

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  15. COMMANDO

    COMMANDO Senior Member

    IWM packing of a parachute to a trolley (dropping without container)
     

    Attached Files:

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  16. Gary Kennedy

    Gary Kennedy Member

    Thanks for the various pictures and descriptions. I won't pretend it's an item I was familiar with so they've been very interesting.

    I checked back on a couple of example loading lists for Parachute Bns in the two main 1944 airborne ops. They are very brief, and only detail total personnel and any major items on each transport. 12 Para (Jun44) identifies containers with mortar and MMG loads, plus containers with no load specified. 156 Para (Sep44) lists bicycles and motorcycles but nothing for containers.

    Gary
     
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  17. JimHerriot

    JimHerriot Ready for Anything

    Good afternoon Commando, thanks for all your work on this.

    I found the photo series of the Polish Parachutists on exercise on the IWM website too, and other than John Weeks' own memories, he my well have been prompted when writing his book by the info on the backing cards (posted below with the associated photos that you have in the thread above, for reference).

    Apologies by being a bit behind with this, I was distracted! (see thread here; Airborne in North Africa )

    Kind regards, always,

    Jim.

    large_H_023118_1.jpg

    large_H_023118_2.jpg

    large_H_023119_1.jpg

    large_H_023119_2.jpg

    large_H_023120_1.jpg

    large_H_023120_2.jpg

    large_H_023121_1.jpg

    large_H_023121_2.jpg
     
    Last edited: Aug 30, 2020
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  18. Aixman

    Aixman WE addict Patron

    A lot of valuable information came together during the last two weeks (while I wasn't watching).
    Many thanks to the contributors.

    Aixman
     
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  19. Tricky Dicky

    Tricky Dicky Don'tre member

    Was looking for something and came across this file at TNA


    Folding trolley Mk. II: dropping tests from various aircraft | The National Archives
    Reference: AVIA 21/151
    Description:
    Folding trolley Mk. II: dropping tests from various aircraft
    Date: 1944-1945
    Held by: The National Archives, Kew
    Former reference in its original department: A.F.E.E/P118 pts. 1-2
    Legal status: Public Record(s)
    Closure status: Open Document, Open Description

    TD
     
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