European Civil War

Discussion in 'Historiography' started by Owen, Sep 28, 2012.

  1. Owen

    Owen -- --- -.. MOD

    Went around la Carrière Wellington in Arras today & really enjoyed it but let out an 'Argh' at end of the 10 minute film when the commentary end with something like ''...some called it a European Civil War.''
    Kids told me to ''shush''.
     
  2. Ramiles

    Ramiles Researching 9th Lancers, 24th L and SRY

    According to the wiki "this article has many issues" ;) and "may present fringe theories without giving appropriate weight to the mainstream"

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/European_Civil_War#/media/File:Latest_War_Map_of_Europe_1870.jpg

    [​IMG]

    Presumably by this stance of any war in Europe potentially being "a civil war" then any war in any part of the world would thereby be a "world war", classic :D I wonder which "world war" we are up to now then??!

    Just Googling to see when Europe was most unified:

    https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=When+was+europe+most+unified&oq=When+was+europe+most+unified+&aqs=chrome..69i57.6044j1j7&sourceid=chrome&es_sm=93&ie=UTF-8

    This page oddly seems to miss out Rome:
    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ideas_of_European_unity_before_1945

    But... The name Europe originally referred to only the south-eastern part of the continent

    So maybe any Balkan war - ??? Perhaps ???

    But "back then" Asia and Africa were also differently defined...

    Europe: http://ancienthistory.about.com/od/maps/ss/mapsindex.htm#step5

    And Herodotus: http://f.tqn.com/y/ancienthistory/1/S/0/f/2/herodot.gif

    Here: http://ancienthistory.about.com/od/maps/ss/mapsindex.htm

    World View of Herodotus, from The Atlas of Ancient and Classical Geography by Samuel Butler, Ernest Rhys, editor (Suffolk, 1907, repr. 1908)


    [​IMG]

    Seems to lack Ireland and Great Britain as being a part of Europe at all ;)
     
  3. Sheldrake

    Sheldrake The Mayor of London's latest dress code

    The idea of wars between European states as a civil war goes back to the concept of Europe as the christian, civilized world, based on the Roman and then Holy Roman Empire whose citizens shared a common faith, heritage and laws. War between Christian states was "Civil War."
     
  4. Ramiles

    Ramiles Researching 9th Lancers, 24th L and SRY

    civil

    ˈsɪv(ə)l,-ɪl/

    adjective





    1. relating to ordinary citizens and their concerns, as distinct from military or ecclesiastical matters.
      "civil aviation"
      synonyms: secular, non-religious, lay; More


















    2. courteous and polite.
      "they were comparatively civil to their daughter"
      synonyms: polite, courteous, well mannered, well bred, gentlemanly, chivalrous,gallant, ladylike, gracious, respectful; More


      Def. Not WW2 then... "whose citizens shared a common faith, heritage and laws" :pipe:

      And my dictionary defines a "Civil War" as a war between the citizens of the same country. Even the EU can't claim to have made the whole of Europe one country quite yet ;)




     
  5. Owen

    Owen -- --- -.. MOD

    Just read the term "European Civil War" at the start of Chapter 5 of A Concise History of the Spanish Civil War.(1996 edition)

    2020-09-21 09.15.51.jpg
     
  6. idler

    idler GeneralList

    You'd think after 20 years, people might have noticed the lack of dreaminess arising from the Russian revolution...
     
  7. ltdan

    ltdan Nietenzähler

    Hiram Maxim first worked with gas illumination, then electricity.
    In 1883 a friend told him, "Hang your electricity. If you want to make your fortune, invent something to help these fool Europeans kill each other more quickly!"
    And he excelled at this...
     
    canuck and smdarby like this.
  8. Harry Ree

    Harry Ree Very Senior Member

    European Civil War was the term used by US opponents of FDR's path to war from its former foreign policy of "splendid isolationism" during the inter war years.

    These "splendid isolationists" factions urged FDR not to get involved with a conflict far away in Europe which they described as a European Civil War.It proved to be a watershed of US foreign policy..."splendid isolationism" has not seen the light of day since the US entered the Second World War.

    As it was, FDR had to deal with the Third Reich support within the US opposing the entering the war in Europe. Charles Lindbergh was a leading admirer of Hitler.FDR countered the adverse influence he had in the US by "harnessing" his navigational talents for the good of the USAAF with an assignment in the Pacific theatre of operations.

    It would appear to Lindbergh that he was being recognised as an expert in air navigation, but in fact,it was flattery and all about negating any influence Lindbergh had in opposing FDR's emerging foreign policy.
     

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