Dunkirk 1940. Inland. France & Belgium. Photos, some never seen before

Discussion in '1940' started by morrisc8, Jan 23, 2018.

  1. Uncle Target

    Uncle Target Mist over Dartmoor

    Well, well! they said that they wrecked them. A lot of their kit was tipped into the canal. Particularly the 18 pounders which they wrecked first.
    The Howitzers probable went into the sea in bits. They spent a day or more wrecing the kit.
    The BC 266 Bty was wounded in the throat in his OP on Bray Dunes but was evacuated. Some were killed by a bomb on the Mole queuing for HMS Worcester some went into the sea when she collided with the Maid of Orleans (I think).
    'A' was A Troop Worcester 265 Battery 18pounders along with B Troop. C and D Troop were 266 Malvern Battery 4.5 Howitzers.
    Pity the men are all dead now. The last one went a few months ago aged 102.
    I will mention these to my colleagues in our tiny group who are the sons and grandsons of the men who fought there.
    They will be surprised!
    Thank you for looking.
     
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  2. John West

    John West Active Member

    There are some similarities between your small group and one we have formed from descendants of another TA Field Regiment, the 140th (5th London) Field Regiment RA.

    'Our' 140 Rgt (BEF marking '10') was split into two during the withdrawal to Dunkirk. 367 Battery plus HQ were sent to provide 18 pounders to support145 Brigade at Cassel and were all killed or captured there; 366 Battery, like your 265/266 Batteries, managed to reach Dunkirk and most were evacuated.

    Lt George Somerwill's diary (within our group's 140 Rgt RA website) provides a graphic description of the withdrawal and aftermath- Lt. George Somerwill’s Diary – 140th (5th London) Army Field Regiment, Royal Artillery
     
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  3. morrisc8

    morrisc8 Under the Bed

    Thank you for showing a link to the diary.
    In the diary there is a photo of Dutch Skoot, beached at Dunkirk 1940, showing shallow draught. The photo is of the Thames barge Barbara Jean , left on the beach, not a Dutch skoot.
    Photos of the Barbara Jean, from my collection.
    barge BJ Dunkirk 1940 on beach. original photo.jpg dunkirk barge Barbara jean.jpg
     
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  4. John West

    John West Active Member

    ah thanks will correct.
     
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  5. morrisc8

    morrisc8 Under the Bed

    I think these are 18Pdr field guns. Pre war photos taken from my negatives .
    Keith
    morris art gun 18Pdr.JPG truck with limber and gun 18Pdr.JPG
     
  6. morrisc8

    morrisc8 Under the Bed

    One more Morris CS9 AC
    Morris CS9 AC 1940.jpg
     
  7. Uncle Target

    Uncle Target Mist over Dartmoor

    The Quads belonging to 67th Field Regt RA (TA) can with some confidence be allocated to their Batteries by location.
    They arrived in good order and set up their positions as designated. 266 Bty were on Bray Dunes so their vehicles would be on the beach behind their positions.
    265 Bty defended the canal and reported that they spiked their 18 pdr guns and tipped them into the canal.
    See my rough sketch, based on a post war sketch by Maj Tom Averill 67th Field Regt / Dunkirk Veterans Association.

    BBC - WW2 People's War - Dunkirk 1940


    My hand sketch Defence of Dunkirk Beaches.jpg
     
    Last edited: Nov 29, 2021
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  8. morrisc8

    morrisc8 Under the Bed

    Found a few more 18Pdrs taken from my original negs. Last one from ww1.
    Keith
    FIELD GUN 1.jpg ww1 neg photo gun (2) (2018_01_13 18_51_57 UTC).jpg
     
  9. Richelieu

    Richelieu Well-Known Member

    I think that they are 4.5 inch Howitzers Keith.
     
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  10. morrisc8

    morrisc8 Under the Bed

    Thank you Richelieu for the info.
    Keith
     
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  11. Wobbler

    Wobbler Well-Known Member

    Keith, I note from Derek’s site that “5” would have been on the vehicles of a few Field Regiments with the BEF, including 92nd. Is it possible, therefore, that these vehicles, together with those in Rich’s photos, could be from any of those other Regiments? Mind you, I’m not sure that isn’t a triangular formation sign (?) on the rear in your photo 2, which points more towards 67 as you say.

    I got quite excited seeing the “5” in these photos and thinking blimey, was that possibly my grandad’s Quad (hence my current avatar)…Mind you, he was in 368 Battery, not “A”.

    Forgive my ignorance of the numbering and Battery systems, learning all the time! :D
     
    Last edited: Dec 7, 2021
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  12. Uncle Target

    Uncle Target Mist over Dartmoor

    The photos in post #288 the top is of 4.5 inch howitzers. Below is an 18pdr. or 18/25 pdr conversion. It seems the TA had 18pdrs the Regulars had the conversion.
    Note from "Ramsbury at War" by Roger Day: each battery consisted of three Troops, A, B and C in 265 Battery and D, E and F in 266 Battery, (A,B and C Troops were equipped with antiquated 18 pounder guns, some of which had been converted to 25 pounders, whilst D,E and F troops each possessed four 4.5" howitzers which fired a 35lb shell. These howitzers were also very ancient; two were dated 1898 while a third had entered service in 1912).
    This information I believe, came from an interview with Tom Averill at one of their Dunkirk Veterans reunions.
    Tom might have been speaking about the guns taken to Ramsbury and Aldbourne in Wiltshire from Worcestershire. As the use of such varied guns both 18pdr and 25 pdr (conversions) ammunition would have been a logistical nightmare. The type of gun did not change but aged ones would surely have been replaced when they joined 1st Infantry Division mostly Regulars from the 48th Div (TA)..
    Although both Tom and Peter Raban (a Lieutenant in A Troop) only talk of 18 pounders and 4.5 howitzers in their diaries.
    During their live firing exercises on Salisbury Plain they seem to have used the guns of the 99th Field Regt.
    Below is a photograph of the Quads guns and limbers in the grounds of the Old Vicarage Aldbourne, Courtesy of the Shepherd family Collection.
    The officer on the horse is possibly from the camps permanent staff or a visiting vip
     

    Attached Files:

    Last edited: Dec 7, 2021
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  13. morrisc8

    morrisc8 Under the Bed

    Morris truck and a strange truck with lots of side doors aos 21 on the back. Photo from my collection.
    Keith
    BEF trucks 1940 morris. kb.jpg
     
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  14. Rich Payne

    Rich Payne Rivet Counter Patron 1940 Obsessive

    Is that part of the Sanatorium Maritime at Zuydcoote ? A strange vehicle indeed. It looks French.
     
  15. morrisc8

    morrisc8 Under the Bed

    The strange vehicle has the white squire and 21.
    BEF trucks 1940 morris. kb 1.jpg
     
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  16. Rich Payne

    Rich Payne Rivet Counter Patron 1940 Obsessive

    Is it a '21' or ''Z1' ? It appears to have a ventilator on the roof...'21' with no GHQ or Corps bar would normally be an infantry battalion...or is it a trailer that a unit 'adopted' ?
     
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  17. JCB

    JCB Senior Member

    Could be a bread van , probably impressed with that curved bodywork.
    Craig
     
  18. morrisc8

    morrisc8 Under the Bed

    New in this week. 1940. Original German photos taken from my negatives. Germans in a blown up village or town, lots of info in the photos, no name of the village. There is a name on the blown up bridge.
    Keith
    neg blown up town village fire kb.JPG neg Germans 1940. kb.JPG neg blown up town village fire red cross. kb.JPG neg blown up town village bridge 1940.kb.JPG neg blown up town village bridge 1940.ww2.close up.JPG
     
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  19. AB64

    AB64 Senior Member

    Last edited: Jan 9, 2022
  20. morrisc8

    morrisc8 Under the Bed

    This may or may not be the same village. Original German photos taken from my negatives. Germans in a blown up village or town, maybe some French pows.
    Added some colour.
    Keith
    neg blown up town village French pow diging colour kb 1.JPG neg blown up town village French pow diging.JPG
     
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