Desert Rat - Burma?

Discussion in 'Burma & India' started by spall, Apr 22, 2011.

  1. spall

    spall Junior Member

    I am looking for my grandads war records, but dont have a lot to go on other than this :

    Leslie Butler born 20/08/1921

    Desert Rats

    Places he was : Burma, Egypt,

    Years I think he was in 1942, 1944?

    any help forward ?

    Thanks

    Simon
     
  2. idler

    idler GeneralList Patron

    Sounds like he was in 7th Armoured Brigade, so that narrows down the search a bit. If you do a search on 'army service records' you should find details of how to apply for them, though it's not a quick process.

    There's a book by Patrick Delaforce that has a bit more on the brigade.
     
  3. Drew5233

    Drew5233 #FuturePilot Patron 1940 Obsessive

    Helo and welcome to the forum...As Idler says, apply for a copy of his service records, they will tell you the unit and then you can view/obtain copies of the units war diaries.

    Just shout if you need any help.

    Cheers
    Andy
     
  4. Tom Canning

    Tom Canning WW2 Veteran WW2 Veteran

    Simon
    There is yet another book on the activities of 7th Armoured bde - it's by Stu
    Hamilton M.C. called "Armoured Odessey " and is a good account of their actions both in the desert - Burma - and back to Egypt to be re-formed with 2nd - 6th and 8th RTR and sent to Italy where they took a vital part in the battles of Croce and Gemmano in the Gothic Line with 46th and 56th Divs.

    It's a good read...
    Cheers
     
  5. spall

    spall Junior Member

    some intetesting info there, thanks for the welcome, i ordered the book for 0.01p off amazon 2 quid delivery not bad

    also i do remember him saying he went to italy, he always talked about his tattoos he had and medals

    He was also Tied up by the italians but he got away to a farm and rang the army to come get him
     
  6. spall

    spall Junior Member

    here is a photo of him, if anyone can work out, any information from this photo would be fantastic.


    Thanks
     

    Attached Files:

  7. Tom Canning

    Tom Canning WW2 Veteran WW2 Veteran

    Spall - The book which will give you verse and chapter on the 7th Armoured Bde in Burma - Churchills Desert Rats #2- by Patrick Delaforce -ISBN -0 -7509 - 2929 -4 it follws the 7th Armourd div but has these chapters on both Burma and Italy - and it appears that the brigade was a small one of 7th Hussars and 2nd RTR as well as 414 Battery RHA ( Essex Yeomanry)

    Fom the blurry picture you have scanned I saw no Black Beret and would assume that he was in the RHA - they left Egypt for Burma in March '42
    Cheers
     
  8. Tom Canning

    Tom Canning WW2 Veteran WW2 Veteran

    Spall

    The brigade that went to Burma is outlined above and on the way back to Egypt the 2nd RTR joined the 6th and 8th RTR to continue the 7th Armoured to Italy - the 7th Hussars went on to Italy also - with the Polish Corps after Cassino towards Ancona and did very well - they were then pulled out and over to Logo Trasemino for DD tank training for the attack over the Lago Commachio- don't know where the 414 RHA went...
    Cheers
     
  9. spall

    spall Junior Member

    Spall - The book which will give you verse and chapter on the 7th Armoured Bde in Burma - Churchills Desert Rats #2- by Patrick Delaforce -ISBN -0 -7509 - 2929 -4 it follws the 7th Armourd div but has these chapters on both Burma and Italy - and it appears that the brigade was a small one of 7th Hussars and 2nd RTR as well as 414 Battery RHA ( Essex Yeomanry)

    Fom the blurry picture you have scanned I saw no Black Beret and would assume that he was in the RHA - they left Egypt for Burma in March '42
    Cheers

    he was in yorkshire regiment I think ?
     
  10. sol

    sol Very Senior Member

    Hi Simon. Do you know anything else about your grandad's service, like did he served in tank or some other service like infantry or artillery. For example 1st West Yorkshire Regiment, infantry unit, was attached to the 7th Armoured Brigade during its campaign in Burma in 1942. But it stay in Burma and India during whole war and didn't served in Egypt. None of both armoured regiments from the brigade wasn't from Yorkshire, just like also 414 Battery RHA. There was also a battery from 95th Anti-Tank Regiment RA but not sure from where they were. But than again he maybe didn't served in any of these unit. With all these info we can only guess. So any other info you have or can find could be helpful.
     
  11. spall

    spall Junior Member

    Hi Simon. Do you know anything else about your grandad's service, like did he served in tank or some other service like infantry or artillery. For example 1st West Yorkshire Regiment, infantry unit, was attached to the 7th Armoured Brigade during its campaign in Burma in 1942. But it stay in Burma and India during whole war and didn't served in Egypt. None of both armoured regiments from the brigade wasn't from Yorkshire, just like also 414 Battery RHA. There was also a battery from 95th Anti-Tank Regiment RA but not sure from where they were. But than again he maybe didn't served in any of these unit. With all these info we can only guess. So any other info you have or can find could be helpful.

    I might be getting confused but yes India now that rings a bell, its only on my memory when i was a child.
     
  12. spall

    spall Junior Member

    Yes someone said its the cawnpore helmet.
     
  13. Owen

    Owen -- --- -.. MOD

  14. spall

    spall Junior Member

    Thanks owen yes thats what im going to do. I ordered his death certificate so fingers crossed.
     
  15. Owen

    Owen -- --- -.. MOD

    Good idea not to buy anymore books until you know the right unit.
    You can use the money to pay for the paper work instead.
    Is your Grandmother still alive, if so the service records wont cost anything.
     
  16. spall

    spall Junior Member

    No. I wished i started this earlier would have been alot easier, one thing tho is that picture may have something written on the back of it but we are afraid to take it out the frame as its so old.
     
  17. spall

    spall Junior Member

    Since I started with this post, I had found his service record and other papers.

    He served in Yorks and Lancs Regiment 1938-1945
    Then onto the northumberland fusiliers in reserve. 1946

    I have also sent for his records anyhow, as I hope they will tell me more.
     
  18. Owen

    Owen -- --- -.. MOD

    He served in Yorks and Lancs Regiment 1938-1945

    Might be 2nd Bn Y & L.
    They at Tobruk & then in Burma as Chindits.
     
  19. spall

    spall Junior Member

    Hi Owen, yes thanks for that, this sounds very likely as he did go to egypt as it states for the 2nd bn. as it also says south yorkshire.

    chindits?
     
  20. bamboo43

    bamboo43 Very Senior Member

    Hi spall,

    Chindits was the name given to Orde Wingate's special operations troops in Burma 1943/44.

    There was a previous discussion on the forum concerning the 2nd Yorks. and Lancs.

    I will find it and post here later.:)
     

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