CWGC Headstone/Memorial Error Reports and results.

E-mail to CWGC dated 22 August about casualties of 102 LAA Regt (My Dad's Regiment) listed against 102 AT Regiment (Northumberland Hussars).

Dear Sir/Madam

Dear Sir/Madam

I believe you have some incorrect data recorded in the unit text line against the following 2 casualties who died on the same date and the same incident:-

NEWMAN, WILLIAM JOHN
Initials: W J
Nationality: United Kingdom
Rank: Serjeant
Regiment/Service: Royal Artillery
Unit Text: 337 Bty., 102 (The Northumberland Hussars) Lt. A.A.
Regt.
Age: 33
Date of Death: 26/07/1945
Service No: 4808515
Casualty Type: Commonwealth War Dead
Grave/Memorial Reference: Panel 4. Column 1.
Memorial: BROOKWOOD MEMORIAL

TODD, JOSEPH TAIT
Initials: J T
Nationality: United Kingdom
Rank: Gunner
Regiment/Service: Royal Artillery
Unit Text: 337 Bty., 102 (The Northumberland Hussars) Lt. A.A. Regt.
Age: 20
Date of Death: 26/07/1945
Service No: 14554896
Additional information: Son of Joseph and Georgina Todd, of Kilcreggan, Dunbartonshire.
Casualty Type: Commonwealth War Dead
Grave/Memorial Reference: Panel 4. Column 1.
Memorial: BROOKWOOD MEMORIAL

In July 1945, the 2 men above were serving in 337 Battery of 102 Light Anti-Aircraft Regiment, Royal Artillery.
The Northumberland Hussars included in the unit text line is incorrect. The Northumberland Hussars were in fact 102 (Northumberland Hussars) Anti-Tank Regiment, Royal Artillery with 99, 107, 288 and 289 batteries under command and were designated this from 1942.

I attach a copy of the war diary as proof of the fact that it was just 102 LAA Regt.

The Brookwood Memorial inscription for Newman is incorrect as it is listed under the Northumberland Hussars, but Tait is listed under Royal Artillery.
　
Please can you investigate the above and let me know your findings.


PS - There are another 9 listed under 336, 337 and 338 Batteries, who have the Northumberland Hussars in their title and which are also wrong. The majority have the serial number of the Lincolnshire Regiment, from which they were converted in December 1941.

Their details are listed below:-

1942

STANIFORTH, GEORGE HENRY
Initials: G H
Nationality: United Kingdom
Rank: Gunner
Regiment/Service: Royal Artillery
Unit Text: 336 Bty., 102 (The Northumberland Hussars) Lt. A.A. Regt.
Age: 31
Date of Death: 16/07/1942
Service No: 4808612
Additional information: Son of Frederick and Charlotte Staniforth, of Crowle; husband of Irene Staniforth, of Crowle.
Casualty Type: Commonwealth War Dead
Grave/Memorial Reference: Grave 1174.
Cemetery: CROWLE CEMETERY

ALGAR, ERIC ALFRED
Initials: E A
Nationality: United Kingdom
Rank: Gunner
Regiment/Service: Royal Artillery
Unit Text: 336 Bty., 102 (The Northumberland Hussars) Lt. A.A. Regt.
Age: 29
Date of Death: 17/09/1942
Service No: 4807167
Additional information: Husband of Mabel Algar, of Brigg.
Casualty Type: Commonwealth War Dead
Grave/Memorial Reference: Sec. D. Grave 19.
Cemetery: SCUNTHORPE (CROSBY) CEMETERY

1943

WALKER, GEORGE HENRY
Rank: Lance Bombardier
Regiment/Service: Royal Artillery
Unit Text: 338 Bty., 102 (The Northumberland Hussars) Lt. A.A. Regt.
Age: 31
Date of Death: 06/05/1943
Service No: 4808234
Additional information: Son of John Henry and Sarah Jane Walker, of Stamford; husband of Irene Walker, of Stamford.
Grave/Memorial Reference: Sec. S. Grave 11T.
Cemetery: STAMFORD CEMETERY

PARKER, WALTER CHARLES
Rank: Gunner
Regiment/Service: Royal Artillery
Unit Text: 338 Bty., 102 (The Northumberland Hussars) Lt. A.A.
Regt. Date of Death: 14/06/1943
Service No: 4808211
Additional information: Husband of Norah B. Parker, of Grimsby.
Grave/Memorial Reference: Sec. G.G. Grave B.13.
Cemetery: CLEETHORPES CEMETERY

EDWARDS, NORMAN BRYSON
Rank: Gunner
Regiment/Service: Royal Artillery
Unit Text: 337 Bty., 102 (The Northumberland Hussars) Lt. A.A. Regt.
Date of Death: 10/11/1943
Service No: 4808384
Additional information: Husband of G. Edwards, of Scunthorpe.
Grave/Memorial Reference: Sec. A. Grave 167.
Cemetery: SCUNTHORPE (CROSBY) CEMETERY

1944

SWINGLER, KENNETH WILSON
Rank: Gunner
Regiment/Service: Royal Artillery
Unit Text: 338 Bty., 102 (The Northumberland Hussars) Lt. A.A. Regt.
Age: 29
Date of Death: 02/07/1944
Service No: 4808621
Additional information: Son of Sydney Sendall Swingler and Annie Elizabeth Swingler, of Louth, Lincolnshire; husband of Edith Swingler, of Louth.
Grave/Memorial Reference: I. A. 3.
Cemetery: RANVILLE WAR CEMETERY

BOLAM, CHARLES SYLVESTER
Rank: Gunner
Regiment/Service: Royal Artillery
Unit Text: 338 Bty., 102 (The Northumberland Hussars) Lt. A.A. Regt.
Age: 33
Date of Death: 18/09/1944
Service No: 4808296
Additional information: Son of Robert and Daisy Bolam, of Grantham, Lincolnshire; husband of Marjorie Bolam, of Grantham.
Grave/Memorial Reference: Divn. 67. Row O. Grave 4.
Cemetery: STE. MARIE CEMETERY, LE HAVRE

WARBURTON, EDWIN
Rank: Gunner
Regiment/Service: Royal Artillery
Unit Text: 338 Bty., 102 (The Northumberland Hussars) Lt. A.A.
Regt. Age: 36
Date of Death: 24/10/1944
Service No: 1744862
Additional information: Husband of Doris Warburton, of Tyldesley, Lancashire.
Grave/Memorial Reference: V. A. 8.
Cemetery: LEOPOLDSBURG WAR CEMETERY

1946

ELLIS, JOHN ROBERT
Initials: J R
Nationality: United Kingdom
Rank: Gunner
Regiment/Service: Royal Artillery
Unit Text: 336 Bty., 102 (The Northumberland Hussars) Lt. A.A. Regt.
Age: 34
Date of Death: 06/12/1946
Service No: 4807884
Additional information: Son of John Robert and Mabel Ellis, of Grimsby; husband or Eva Gertrude Ellis, of Grimsby.
Casualty Type: Commonwealth War Dead
Grave/Memorial Reference: Sec. 116. Row L. Grave 15.
Cemetery: GRIMSBY (SCARTHO ROAD) CEMETERY

-----------------------------------------------------------------------

Acknowledged, but no answer to my query.

 

Thank you for your e-mail of 18th October 2010.



Our records confirm your observation that the panel number that Flying Officer Harold Kenneth Coates’ name is commemorated on had been referenced incorrectly within the Commission’s records for the Runnymede Memorial.



Naturally, we are keen to ensure that all such errors are corrected, however small, and I am grateful to you for drawing this to our attention. I have amended Flying Officer Coates' record which now reads:



Flying Officer COATES, HAROLD KENNETH
Unit: 49 Sqdn.
Regiment: Royal Air Force Volunteer Reserve
Service No: 130651
Date of Death: 4 September 1943
Commemoration: RUNNYMEDE MEMORIAL
United Kingdom
Panel 123.



Thank you again for bringing this matter to our attention.

 

Lance Corporal KENNETH C. JONES
2930482- Cameronians
Who died on Sunday 24 December 1944 . Age 28 .
Son of William Coetmor Jones and Eva Jones, of Southport, Lancashire.
FLORENCE WAR CEMETERYItaly VI. G. 10. [Headstone has incorrect initials] On headstone R C Jones


Dear Mr Mitchell
Thank you for your e-mail of 23rd August 2010, regarding the difference of the initials of Lance Corporal Kenneth C Jones as shown on his headstone, to those given in his records.

Our records confirm your observation that Lance Corporal Jones’ initials have been transferred incorrectly onto his headstone. This was due to an error in the documentation required for the inscription of his headstone. Arrangements are, therefore now in hand for the necessary amendment to be carried out within these records, and the amendment will be made to Lance Corporal Jones’ headstone the next time it is replaced.
Thank you again for bringing this error to our attention.

Yours sincerely,
Paul Davis
Enquiries Administrator
Commonwealth War Graves Commission

 

Seems to have been some clear results here. Well worth the time and effort.

Well done to all.

 

Just had a good read of this thread; well done everyone.

With regard to the possible non commemorated. As he has a non world war grave I would say that his death was post discharge. Now to get him war grave status his death would have to be connected with his service. Anyone have further info on him?

Can take him on if you wish

Chris

 

Quote:
This is another headstone I have reported from Durnbach War Cemetery in Germany however as yet I have not been advised that it has been actioned.

The insignia should be for the RAAF however the insignia for the Liverpool Scottish Camerons was used in error.

http://www.ww2talk.com/forum/attachments/war-cemeteries-war-memorial-research/40369d1289480783t-cwgc-headstone-memorial-error-reports-results-roberts_j-dfc-web-jpg
Another one confirmed corrected and reported back to me with photos of the replacement.

The forecast time span was not far off!

1st and 2nd emails attached.

http://www.ww2talk.com/forum/attachments/war-cemeteries-war-memorial-research/41241d1290690109t-cwgc-headstone-memorial-error-reports-results-roberts_j-dfc-new-jpghttp://www.ww2talk.com/forum/attachments/war-cemeteries-war-memorial-research/41242d1290690109t-cwgc-headstone-memorial-error-reports-results-roberts_j-dfc-row-jpg

Quote:
Dear Mr Swallow

Further to my email of 31 July 2009 regarding the grave of Flying Officer J. Roberts, DFC in Durnbach War Cemetery.

I am pleased to information you that a new headstone has now been erected and attach some photographs of the completed work.

Peter Stainthorpe
Enquiries Section
Quote:
From: casualty.enq [mailto:casualty.enq@cwgc.org]
Sent: 31 July 2009 11:16
To: 'spidge@bigpond.net.au'
Subject: CEM 19483/Records

Dear Mr Swallow

Thank you for your email of 14 June 2009 concerning the headstone marking the grave of 416893 Flying Officer J. Roberts, DFC in Durnbach War Cemetery, Germany.

Our records confirm your observation that the headstone has been engraved with the incorrect cap badge. Arrangements are, therefore, now in hand for the headstone to be replaced. However, I should explain that it can take up to 15 months for a headstone to be engraved in our workshops in France, transported to Germany, and erected.

I shall let you know as soon as this has taken place and send you a photograph of the completed work.

Peter Stainthorpe
Enquiries Section

 

Thank you for your email and photograph of the memorial commemorating Ordinary Seaman Dennis F Hatton.

The memorial was erected by the family of the war casualty and as we do not own the memorial we are not permitted to carry out repairs to the memorial.

Our Regional Supervisor has been informed and he will investigate further and if necessary, make arrangements to erect a commission headstone upon the grave.

Thank you for bringing this matter to our attention.

Yours sincerely

 

I've had my first failure to get an entry amended and it will require further investigation. A casualty listed as having served with 119 Battery, 89 LAA Regt, RA was buried in Gaza. 89 LAA were in the UK with the 49th Division in 1942 and did not have a 119 battery under command. 49 LAA had them attached up until November 1941 and then they were placed under War Office Control. Which LAA unit did they go to next that ended up in the Middle East?

There is a war diary for 119 LAA Bty at Kew, which puts them in the Middle East, where the casualty died. I will look at it early next year to see if I can shed more light on this casualt and the correct unit he was attached to.

E-mail to CWGC on the 15th October 2010

Dear Sir/Madam

I have found a casualty with possible incorrect unit details.


Name: POINTER, ERNEST FREDERICK
Rank: Bombardier
Regiment/Service: Royal Artillery
Unit Text: 119 Bty., 89 (11th Bn. The Buffs [Royal East Kent Regt.] Lt. A.A. Regt.
Secondary Regiment: Royal Artillery
Age: 28
Date of Death: 12/11/1942
Service No: 1616890
Grave/Memorial Reference: B. B. 8.
Cemetery: GAZA WAR CEMETERY

89 LAA did not have a 119 Battery under command. They had 308, 309 & 310 batteries.

89 were in the UK in 1942 and not in the Middle East.

49 LAA had a 119 Battery and were in Algiers around the date of the burial of Bombadier Pointer, so 49 maybe have been typed as 89.

I look forward to hearing from you in due course.
-----------------------------------------------------------------------Reply from CWGC today 25 November 2010

Thank you for your email dated 15th October, 2010, relating to Bombardier Ernest Pointer. I would like to apologise for the delay in replying to your email, I was waiting for confirmation of the unit in which this casualty served.

All the documents that we have in our records and the information received from the service authority after the war confirm the details shown below.

However, if you have documents in your possession that indicate otherwise please send them to casualty.enq@cwgc.org marked for my attention, and I will be happy to have a look at them.

Thank you for your interest.

Bombardier POINTER, ERNEST FREDERICK
Unit: 119 Bty., 89 (11th Bn. The Buffs [Royal East Kent Regt.] Lt. A.A. Regt.
Regiment: Royal Artillery
Secondary Regiment: Royal Artillery
Service No: 1616890
Age: 28
Date of Death: 12 November 1942
Commemoration: GAZA WAR CEMETERY
Israel
Plot B. Row B. Grave 8.

 

A question for Chris Harley or anyone else in the know! Re WW1 plot.

I also collect all the headstone photos of the Australian "Air Force" deaths from WW1 "around the world" and came across this lad at the Melbourne General Cemetery Carlton which I must admit made me a bit emotional after searching on three different occasions and finding it in such a state.

His death was in 1921 - Should he be entitled to a CWGC headstone?

The headstone was all facing down and there seem to be two pieces missing.

I can fix (paint) the wrought iron and tidy the grave but cannot repair the headstone even if I was given permission.

In Memory of
Air Mechanic 1st Class THEODORE STANLEY GILLETT

387, Australian Flying Corps
who died
on 12 April 1921
Son of Mr. and Mrs. E. A. Gillett, of Abbotsford.
Remembered with honour
MELBOURNE GENERAL CEMETERY, CARLTON

http://www.aif.adfa.edu.au:8080/showPerson?pid=111456

GILLETT-the Friends of Mrs. ELIZABETH ANN GILLETT are respectfully invited to follow the remains of her dearly beloved son Theodore Stanley to the place of interment, the Melbourne General Cemetery.
The funeral will leave her residence 61 Gipps street, East Melbourne, this day (Wednesday 13th April 1921) at 11 o'clock a.m.
JOHN ALLISON, Undertaker, Head Office, Richmond North Telephones-Central 1D03 and 2038, Brunswick 692

GILLETT -The Brethren of the EARL OF CARNARVON LODGE, No. 101 A.C, and the craft in general are respectfully invited to follow the remains of our late esteemed brother, Theodore Stanley Gillett, to the place of interment, the Melbourne General Cemetery.
The funeral will leave the residence of his mother, Mrs. Elizabeth A. Gillett, 6? Gipps street, East Melbourne, THIS (Wednesday) MORNING, 13th April 1921 at 11 a.m.


Cheers

Geoff

 

I have three instances that I am awaiting feedback on.

Thomas Culshaw - Prague War Cemetery - Name incribed as Gulshaw
Denis Bradley - Tela New Cemetery - Decsion being made on ability to maintain grave
W.C. Stace - Eldoret Cemetery - Smashed headstone

 

A question for Chris Harley or anyone else in the know! Re WW1 plot.

I also collect all the headstone photos of the Australian "Air Force" deaths from WW1 "around the world" and came across this lad at the Melbourne General Cemetery Carlton which I must admit made me a bit emotional after searching on three different occasions and finding it in such a state.

His death was in 1921 - Should he be entitled to a CWGC headstone?

The headstone was all facing down and there seem to be two pieces missing.

I can fix (paint) the wrought iron and tidy the grave but cannot repair the headstone even if I was given permission.

In Memory of
Air Mechanic 1st Class THEODORE STANLEY GILLETT

387, Australian Flying Corps
who died
on 12 April 1921
Son of Mr. and Mrs. E. A. Gillett, of Abbotsford.
Remembered with honour
MELBOURNE GENERAL CEMETERY, CARLTON

http://www.aif.adfa.edu.au:8080/showPerson?pid=111456

Cheers

Geoff

Geoff - basically yes if he was in service at the time of his death or his cause of death is directly related to his military service if post discharge.

The CWGC cut off date for the Great War is 31st August 1921.

Do you have anything in the way of documentation on him?

Chris

 

Geoff

have just reviewed his service record & he was discharged 17th April 1919. Whilst his service record does refer to his death there is no cause

Chris

 

Geoff - basically yes if he was in service at the time of his death or his cause of death is directly related to his military service if post discharge.

The CWGC cut off date for the Great War is 31st August 1921.

Do you have anything in the way of documentation on him?

Chris

I was toying with the idea of requesting his death certificate however I do not want to get it unless it will confirm some other information that hints that war service was the cause.

Catch22 again?

Cheers

Geoff

 

Yes indeed Geoff; the link to his file is not working at the moment but you should be able to find it at your archives

Chris

 

Yes indeed Geoff; the link to his file is not working at the moment but you should be able to find it at your archives

Chris

I remember that I saw something on his file previously about hospitalisation.

Page 17 top right in red. I am sure it says Repat Melb? Possibly the Repatriation Hospital.

If so, this Hospital was in St Kilda Road Melbourne.

Possibly worth further investigation but it seems unlikely that it would have been connected with his war service.

Cheers

Geoff

 

Geoff

it is sometimes the nature of our type of research that you just cannot make the connection between service & death; only the DC will prove that & in this case I do not think that it is highly probable.

Chris

 

Geoff

it is sometimes the nature of our type of research that you just cannot make the connection between service & death; only the DC will prove that & in this case I do not think that it is highly probable.

Chris

I have not applied for his DC however there are some other areas I can investigate first as you usually need to be NOK or have permission of NOK to apply however I can check that out for a 1921 death.

If he did actually die in the Repatriation Hospital, there may be some records available there.

He was a an active member of his local Lodge, the EARL OF CARNARVON LODGE, No. 101 A.C. I can track that down if still active or go to the Masonic Lodge of Victoria which was coincidentally built on the land of my old college 6 years after I left.

The funeral director company "John Allison" at the time (now John Allison Monkhouse) are one of the largest around so may have some records.

Also, the Melbourne General Cemetery where he was interred is part of a large cemetery administration and may just have a next of kin clue which would assist.

I also have a friend who works at the monumental mason down the road and may have made the original stone. I will give him a call and see if their records go back that far. Good to know what the origial wording was if there is a group, organisation that may come to the fore.

We will have to see what a bit of research brings.

Cheers

Geoff

 

I have received a reply from CWGC re my service number query on the headstone at:
[FONT=&quot]NUNTON OLD CHURCHYARD, ISLE OF BENBECULA[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Dear Mr Swallow[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Thank you for your e mail of 30 October. Please accept our apologies for the delay in reply: due to the high volume of enquiries received by our offices we currently have a back log we are working to clear.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Further to your enquiry concerning the following casualty:[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Flight Sergeant TAPLIN, JOHN BLATCH[/FONT][FONT=&quot]
Unit: 206 (R.A.F.) Sqdn.
Regiment: Royal Australian Air Force
Service No: 407607
Age: 27
Date of Death: 6 October 1942
Commemoration: NUNTON OLD CHURCHYARD, ISLE OF BENBECULA
United Kingdom
West Wall Border.
[FONT=&quot]Additional Information: [/FONT]Son of Alfred Basil John and Estelle Christina Taplin; husband of Nancy Eileen Taplin, of Largs Bay, South Australia.

I understand you believe that the headstone is engraved with the incorrect number: I would appreciate at this stage therefore if you could forward me a photograph of the headstone concerned; I will then advise you accordingly.[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Yours sincerely,

xxxxxx xxxxxxx
[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Enquiries Section[/FONT]

[FONT=&quot]Commonwealth War Graves Commission[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Head Office[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]2 Marlow Road[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Maidenhead[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Berkshire[/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]SL6 7DX[/FONT]

 

Query sent to CWGC in August 2010

Dear Sir/Madam,

In the last week, you received information that the headstone for the casualty shown below was badly worn and needed replacing. I have a query regarding the Unit he served in.

1. The unit text line states 13 space 3 H.A.A. Regt. If it's a typo and should read 133 H.A.A. Regt, then according to the war dairy of this unit at Kew, they were based in the UK for the whole of 1944. He is buried in France.

2. If the unit should be 3 H.A.A. Regt, then they were captured in Singapore in 1942.

Either way, he must have served in another regt of the Royal Artillery.

I look forward to hearing the outcome of your investigation.

Name:EEDE, LIONEL GEORGE
Initials:L G
Nationality:United Kingdom
Rank:Gunner
Regiment/Service:Royal Artillery
Unit Text:13 3 H.A.A. Regt.
Age:40
Date of Death:24/09/1944
Service No:14292665
Additional information:Son of Charles and Alice Eede; husband of Grace Eleanor Eede, of Bournemouth, Hampshire.
Casualty Type:Commonwealth War Dead
Grave/Memorial Reference:Plot 19. Row A. Grave 10.
Cemetery:TERLINCTHUN BRITISH CEMETERY, WIMILLE

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Reply from CWGC dated 3 December 2010

I refer to your e mail to us dated 30 August 2010 concerning Gunner Lionel George Eede, Royal Artillery. Please accept our apologies for the delay in reply, this is due to the high volume of enquiries received by our offices.

I can now confirm that our record of Gunner Eede has been amended to reflect that his unit was 113 HAA Regiment and not 133 HAA Regiment as had been recorded when our records were originally compiled. The amended version follows:

Gunner EEDE, LIONEL GEORGE
Unit: 113 H.A.A. Regt.
Regiment: Royal Artillery
Service No: 14292665
Age: 40
Date of Death: 24 September 1944
Commemoration: TERLINCTHUN BRITISH CEMETERY, WIMILLE
France
Plot 19. Row A. Grave 10.
Additional Information: Son of Charles and Alice Eede; husband of Grace Eleanor Eede, of Bournemouth, Hampshire.

Thank you again, in closing, for bringing this to our attention.


SUCCESSFUL OUTCOME - ENTRY AMENDED ON CWGC DATABASE

 

I have received a reply from CWGC re my service number query on the headstone at:
[FONT=&quot]NUNTON OLD CHURCHYARD, ISLE OF BENBECULA[/FONT]

This is the reply on the incorrect number and is self explanatory.

[FONT=&quot]Thank you for your e mail of 29 November. As confirmed in the photograph which you have kindly forwarded, the headstone of Flight Sergeant John Blatch Taplin does appear to have the second digit incorrectly engraved with a ‘9’ instead of a ‘0’. We are unable to initiate amendments to granite headstones I am afraid, however, please be assured that our paper records concerning the casualty are correct, and at such point in the future when the headstone is replaced, it will of course be engraved with the correct service number. [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot] [/FONT]
[FONT=&quot]Thank you, in closing, for your interest in this matter.

Yours sincerely,



[/FONT]