British Army WWII Documdrama TV Series--If Not Now, When?

Browsing on YouTube today, I listened once again to the main musical theme from the "Band of Brothers" television series. I think it is a fine and very moving piece of music, and an important part of a generally above average television drama that made WWII real again for many viewers. The series was shot in Britain, and many of the actors portraying American soldiers were actually British.

This leads me to address a matter which may have come up here before, namely the idea of a comparable TV series about the British Army in WWII. I am puzzled and a bit shocked by the failure (so far) of the UK film industry to produce such a series. I understand that money and marketing are factors--the US market is of course bigger than the British--but the BBC gets some support from the British government and a good documentary drama series about the army in 1939-45 would surely be worthy of such support. Britain has plenty of fine actors, directors, and writers who could do justice to the subject.

"Band of Brothers," be it noted, was about an elite unit, a company of the 101st Airborne Division. Such outfits have received more than their fair share of artistic and press attention, but if a British (or Australian or Canadian) "Band of Brothers" is ever done then I would strongly urge that an ordinary line unit be chosen as the subject. After all, the soldiers of the line do 90% of the fighting in most wars, and get little of the glory. I may be partial, but I would love to see a series about one of the veteran outfits of 50th Division. The 9th DLI would be the best candidate. The Gateshead Gurkhas were in the thick of it from the Dyle Line in 1940 to the final German surrender in 1945, the outfit has been well covered in the published literature, and abundant archival sources are also available. There are other good candidates too, of course.

What do people think or feel about this? I would especially love to hear from anyone who has connections in the UK TV and entertainment business. Who knows, maybe we could crank up a campaign or a petition.

 

In the past there have been British TV drama documentaries about WW2, such as the 1970s series 'Colditz' (based on events that took place in the German P.O.W). camp. Most of the events that happened in the T.V. series were based on what actually happened.

 

I admit that I am not fully familiar with the treatment of the war on British TV. I did not see "Colditz," though I have heard that it was good. That was a while ago, though. Also, what appealed to me about Band of Brothers was the way in which it showed that war is not a weekend adventure, but a hard grind that takes years.
It showed how a unit grew, matured, and survived attrition and adversity, and that is the story of every successful infantry outfit. Britain was in the war for two years longer than we were, and British units like 1/7th Queen's and 9th DLI saw more heavy combat and suffered greater losses than our infantry did. I think their story needs to be told on film, and told before the last veterans go.

 

Similar sentiments expressed here:

http://army.ca/forums/index.php?topic=46547.0

We simply don't have the population to support big budget films and have to be content with minor productions like Passchendaele. If the Commonwealth countries pooled thier resources we might get that collective story told.

 

A film about Operation Cauldron would be good to see. I'm a little biased but it'd make marvellous viewing ... but I doubt it'll be done, unfortunately.

 

It is a really good suggestion. There are a lot of WW2 army stories along the suggested lines that could be told.

As already indicated, the first obstacle to get over would be financing such a project. For the venture to get off the drawing board it would probably require a collaboration between several interested parties with money, such as T.V. makers from two or three countries who would be able to broadcast the final product in their own land.

 

As to budget:Band of Brothers cost $125 million. The BBC chipped in $10.1 milllion (7 million pounds). Tom Hanks and Steven Spielberg were the motors behind the project, and Tony Blair took a personal interest in it. So, that gives you some idea of the scale of financing that you would need, and also of the kind of heavyweight support that you need. Given the realities of the British production market, you'd have to look beyond the normal sources there for money on this scale. I do know that there are some pretty well-off and public sprited people in Britain who donate to the arts; Richard Branson is worth $4.9 billion. Hanks and Spielberg didn't do this pro-bono, of course; the Chrysler Corporation (vroom vroom) had an extensive advertising tie-in with the project. Britain has some big corporations (Virgin, for example) who might be glad of an advertising opportunity. There is a market in the States for some British TV and film--Dr. Who, the Potter movies--but is it big enough to offer much initial support to a project like this? In any case, I agree that some Commonwealth tie-ins would be advisable. When I was in Australia and Canada I saw much more British TV than you get here, and some British products still find Commonwealth and ex-imperial markets. (Advertisers take note.)

 

http://ww2talk.com/forums/topic/2085-british-mini-series/

 

Thanks for the link, CL 1. Some good stuff there, but I don't think the programs mentioned were quite on the same scale or had exactly the same idea as I was thinking of.

 

As I've said before, British television doesn't do good WWII history anymore. Look at everything on digital....it's all at least ten years old - the newest WWII drama you'll see is Island at War about the Channel Islands starring Gene Hunt....I mean, Philip Glennister.

In the last ten years, the only WWII thing the BBC has turned out has been REAL documentaries....fronted by one Top Gear presenter or another...and the excreble Dunkirk docudrama...complete with its; dodgy off-centre, closeup camera shots to save them having to worry too much about production values in the background, and its weird "helicopter chop" soundtrack! ITV sort of held the line with Foyle's War...but it's only a detective series seen through the rosecoloured glasses of a WWII setting.

Frankly, I'd actually hate to see a British-made WWII series. It's just NOT ever going to match with something like The Way Ahead, or any of the other classic cinema Britain was responsible for, and be such a disappointment.

 

I remain stubbornly hopeful. Given funding and proper marketing I think such a series is possible, and I refuse to believe that Britain lacks the talented people to pull it off. Much of the cast and crew of Band of Brothers was British; were they less talented than their American co-workers? Why do people assume that it wouldn't be any good? "Can't be done, no use trying..." Nothing is ever accomplished if you start with that outlook.

I like The Way Ahead, but it isn't the last word. It was made a long time ago, and while it was excellent it did pull punches in deference to wartime morale considerations and popular taste. In short, it was less than completely honest. While Band of Brothers gave a generally favorable picture of the unit it portrayed, it also made it clear that some of officers were no good, that the army was sometimes inefficient, that the bloodshed was real and very ugly, and that the strain of combat took a severe toll on the men. I think the British public (like the American) could take such honesty in mini series about the war, and that it is a requisite if the story is to be told properly.

 

It's not just to do with how good they are or not - it's as much to do with styles of modern televison productions. The BBC can't do the sort of production you're thinking about - and HBO have already done it...Band Of Brothers - so won't be doing it again LOL

Of course it was - but in a way and to an extent that the audience accepted They accepted the limitations, both the security limitations and what passed for good taste then as per the British Board of Film Censors, 3 Soho Square...as a viewing nation in the 1940s and 1950s we didn't "do" graphic violence, rape, murder...

Compare, say, Jack Warner's murder in The Blue Lamp, with Reservoir Dogs....

Yes they can - but British television companies won't make it. It doesn't have the funding to do it. It's not a case of getting the funding privately, or anything like that; that's not how British television companies commission productions now. They commision either private production companies to make something - or "internally contract" - pay a BBC division make it for...in effect...syndicating round the rest of the network; look at Dr Who, or Sherlock.

Look at Rome; big production values, expensive to make...but a JOINT production between the BBC and HBO. Big production values cost....and network television can't afford it on their own. If they try and do without them...you get a Dunkirk.

And the problem with securing the sort of joint funding needed for a "big production value" WWII British series is...the other part of the joint funding won't be British. And therefore, it won't be interested in funding a British-oriented series.

 

I can't see why it shouldn't happen. We have the skills (many American films are made here in UK now) and the screenwriters etc.

With a fairly guaranteed market in Commonwealth countries any UK or Commonwealth production should have a good sales option. Then there is the wider 'dubbed' market that seems quite active. For some reason US forces seems to be more fascinating for the wider audience, but this could be a factor of the American film and 'internal interest' overview.

For example how did 'Inigma' go in the US ?

 

Phylo, I don't share your view of 'Dunkirk'. I thought it was quite good but obviously not of interest to a large US market, many of whom had probably never heard of Dunkirk.

 

Mike - everyone has their own opinions. My nerves just jangled at the "helicopter chop". For me that was just really lazy cue'ing of the viewers' emotions - "hey it's a programme about war, so it has to sound like war sounds like now"...because that was the "soundtrack" to Gulf War I and II.

...and the strange habit of shooting main characters' faces half on the screen, half off....so that they didn't have to worry TOO much about what was going on in the background. One part that sticks in the mind about that was the scenes of Kevin McNally's Harold Alexander conferencing with Adm. Abrial - McNally's face half off the screen, Abrial fuzzy and indistinct in the background...

Factually, there was absolutely nothing wrong about the content at all. Stylistically - it tried too hard to be a cutting-edge noughties television treatment of a 1940s story. Foyle's War and Island At War showed how that CAN be done properly.

 

I don't think I ever imagined that funding would have to come exclusively from the UK. As has been suggested already, some could come from Commonwealth countries (Oz, Canada) where markets might be more favorable than in the UK. And HBO and other international TV groups have money too; if the marketing was good enough, why wouldn't they want to do it again?

As to The Way Ahead--sure the audience accepted it, but it was less than the truth and I think many in the audience knew or suspected as much. A good series about the army could be more truthful today, which is for me one of the main reasons for doing it. Why all the non possimus here?

 

One never knows. The success of the WW1 Sainsbury's ad could be one of those catalysts for addtional corporate support if they detect sufficient public interest and goodwill to their brands.

 

I suppose one problem at the moment is the anniversary of WW1 which has taken centre stage this year on British television and the BBC in particular.
As an example there was a very good mini series I watched 'The Passing Bells' - joint BBC and Polish TV production

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b04nz99y

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Passing_Bells


Following on from this I note that there is due to be released next year a mini series on Gallipoli :
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gallipoli_%28TV_series%29
Gallipoli is an eight-part Australian television drama series to be telecast on the Nine Network in 2015, the 100th anniversary of the Gallipoli Campaign. Adapted from the best-selling book Gallipoli by Les Carlyon, the series is produced by Endemol Australia and is being shot over a three month period and commenced on 17 March 2014.[1] Filming takes place in Melbourne and surrounding areas including Bacchus Marsh and Werribee. The 25 April 1915, landing will be recreated on the Mornington Peninsula.[2][3][4]

So I think WW1 is taking precedence over WW2 at the moment

TD