African American soldiers based in UK during WW2

Discussion in 'United Kingdom' started by gtwomey, Sep 13, 2008.

  1. dbf

    dbf Moderatrix MOD

    Kuno the term itself is not derogatory in any way; I see it just like Irish American, or Italian American - terms used by members of these groups themselves.
     
    Last edited: Aug 9, 2022
  2. Kuno

    Kuno Very Senior Member

    dbf; you differentiate between Irish, Italian etc... but as soon as the skin becomes dark, they are called "African"... why not Sudanese American, Malian American...

    ...and why not American?
     
  3. dbf

    dbf Moderatrix MOD

    Kuno for that you would have to ask the Americans - I don't differentiate - they all sound American to me. It's their thing, although I don't mind describing myself as a KrautMick now and again ;)

    African American - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

    I know Irish Americans positively revel in the title.
     
    CL1 likes this.
  4. SW6_Blues1905

    SW6_Blues1905 Junior Member

    A lot of people prefer you describe them as African-American than to say that they're "black." Most of the folks in the US who say they're African American are many generations removed from their African ancestors, and have never even set foot on African soil. Some still believe that the term 'black' has a derogatory connotation and prefer the African American term.

    A friend of mine works with folks who were both born in Africa and have emigrated to the US, and black Americans who call themselves African-American. According to my friend, these two groups are always having arguments about the meaning of African-American and how it relates to them.

    I really wish people could make that dis-connect. For the Irish-American example, I've known folks to say that they're "Irish" and have shamrock tattoos and such, and they've never been to Ireland and their closest relative who was actually born in Ireland died long before they were born. Some of that is just an element of pop culture, and the rest is genuine pride in your heritage.
     
  5. A-58

    A-58 Not so senior Member

    The term African-American is not derogatory in any way. Sometimes Afro-American is used too. Both terms are much better than other terms that have been used in the past. As for the question as to why not terms such as "Sudanese-American, Malian-American, Morrocoan-American" or anything else is used, well your guess is as good as any. I figure that most of them came over here against their will so long ago, and that those modern countries did not exist at the time. Besides, most Africans that were seized and brought to the New World were taken from areas of Western Africa, and they probably didn't have the same name for their homelands as we had for them.

    And as for why they are not referred to as Americans, well, most Americans did not originate from here. I wish that we all could be Americans, those of us here in the states that is! Remember, everyone here is from someplace else, and maybe they are proud of their heritage and homelands. I consider myself American, since my heritage is a combination of Scots-Irish and Hessian on my fathers side, and Cajun French on my mothers side. To simplify things, that would technically make me a Western European-American. I prefer to be referred to as a plain old American, but that's just me. I have been called a lot of things before though!
     
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  6. Kuno

    Kuno Very Senior Member

    Hmmmm. Sounds rather complicated. It would really become a lot more difficult to name somebody after a kingdom somewhere in West-Africa, which existed only until about 200 years ago... ... ... I am rather simple minded in this respect anyway. For me, there are only 'Americans', which actually only includes the citizens of the US but not Canadians and those from the southern Countries. Anyhow; I already get confused with the "English" (which for people like me is everybody living on this island north of France) - they insist on being Scotish, Welsh...

    Somehow silly...

    ...human?
     
  7. Owen

    Owen -- --- -.. MOD

    Anyway, we digress, can anyone help SW6 Blues 1905?
    I'm not very good on US units.
    Welcome to the forum Blues.
     
  8. A-58

    A-58 Not so senior Member

    Sure thing Owen, I have some constructive input for a change! Glad to be of assistance.

    This is what I have found out. It is not much because my references mainly concern combat units.

    The U.S. Army separated transportation assets from its Quartermaster branch in 1942 to form a separate Transportation Corps. That is the what the (TC) designator after the 3419th QM Truck Company means. From what I've read, many of these companies maintained the QM designator also, even though they were transferred to the newly created Transportation Corps. These were non-divisional units that were assigned as needed. The troops assigned to these transportation companies were given basic infantry training, then taught to drive and maintain their vehicles "the army way" before being given their assignments and deployed to various theaters of operation.

    Although these transportation units were not front line combat units, they were just as important to the war effort as any units. Without the beans and bullets, the trigger pullers up front would be in a world of hurt without these "muther truckers" as they were affectionately called bringing them the goods.

    Hope this helps a bit, and welcome to the talk Blues.
     
    Owen likes this.
  9. Trudy

    Trudy Junior Member

    Had anyone heard of black soldiers stationed in Yorkshire or Lincolnshire during the run up to D Day? Trudy
     
  10. Skoyen89

    Skoyen89 Senior Member

    Hi Blues and Trudy

    The best source for information on black or afro-american units in Britain is Phil Grinton. He has posted some lists on the internet here; Black Army

    The list for March 1944 shows some units in Kingham but not the 3419th QM Truck Co. He could have been posted into it later?

    As I live in Oxfordshire I am very interested in any of the camps there during WWII so any more photos or details would be really interesting.

    Have you read The Red Ball Express by Pat Ware?

    Cheers
    Skoyen89
     
  11. urqh

    urqh Senior Member

    Acommon Lad byDr John Sandalls has a few references around the Evesham area U nfortunately all bad experiences. 1 pulled a knife in village pub at Bretforton..stabbing landlord..locals beat him to a pulp and he died in US hosp next day at Malvern. Few died at Evesham in river Avon..one running from local bobby..one hung at Birmingham for something I cant get to bottom of at Evesham.
     
  12. A-58

    A-58 Not so senior Member

    Can't we all just get along?
     
  13. Trudy

    Trudy Junior Member

    Many thanks,
    I will try to contact Phil Grinton and look out for The Red Ball Express. I'll also look out for camps in your area, but it is a bit out of our range.

    Trudy
     
  14. kopite

    kopite Member

    I've just finished reading the book Citizens of London by Lynne Olson which touches upon the subject of African Americans stationed in Britain during WW2. There were over 100,000 black soldiers and the U.S. military at that time was still segregated.

    Many Britons were appalled at the treatment of black soldiers, who were very popular among the British public, who viewed them as being "polite, soft-spoken and self-effacing, much like the British themselves" There were even some pubs that displayed signs on the doors that read "For British people and coloured Americans only". On some buses, conductors told blacks not to give up their seats to whites because "they were in England now".

    In one case, Learie Constantine, a famed cricket player from the West Indies, was asked to leave a hotel after several American officers staying there threatened to cancel their reservations if he was not ejected.
     
  15. Dave55

    Dave55 Atlanta, USA

    Other photos: Picasa Gallery


    Very nice photos.

    Does anyone know what type of truck is shown in picture #3 ? The nose looks like some of the airfield tractors I've seen but it is much larger. I can't identify it. Neat truck, though.

    Dave
     
  16. Doc

    Doc Senior Member

    Last night (13 Oct) there was an excellent documentary on mixed race children on BBC, which discussed at length this topic. Doc
     
  17. Vitesse

    Vitesse Senior Member

    I referred to this while we were discussing Guy Gibson's dog in the Dambusters remake thread. During the subsequent court case the hotel's evidence included the information that "American and colonial officers" had complained. So not just the Septics.
     
  18. ceolredmonger

    ceolredmonger Member

    Looks like an International H-542 series, mostlikely the -11 for 10 ton Semi-trailers.

    Very nice photos.

    Does anyone know what type of truck is shown in picture #3 ? The nose looks like some of the airfield tractors I've seen but it is much larger. I can't identify it. Neat truck, though.

    Dave
     
    Dave55 likes this.
  19. wtid45

    wtid45 Very Senior Member

    Anyhow; I already get confused with the "English" (which for people like me is everybody living on this island north of France) - they insist on being Scotish, Welsh...

    Somehow silly...

    ...human?
    I take extreme exception to being called English! Wales the land of my birth, is a seperate country just as Switzerland is to Germany;) whatever next :rolleyes:
     
  20. Dave55

    Dave55 Atlanta, USA

    Well done! I had not heard of that International before.

    That's what I learned about WWII today. :)

    Dave
     

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