Account: 3rd Tank Bn Scots Guards, Jul 1944 - May 1945

Hi Diane,
I do not have any other books on the 3SG other than Farrell's, Forbes for 6th Guards, Bluecoat and Bluecoat 'over the battlefield' books by Ian Daglish (Rest his soul after his untimely death recently) and one other, in French by two authors: Michel Letenturier and Georges Bernages (I think?). I will confirm this tomorrow, hopefully with the ISBN number. this book is Titled: The Guards versus The Hoenstaffen Division (9th SS?) [from start of Bluecoat to end of Op Grouse].

 

I would encourage all with an interest in the Guards in Normandy, to attend the services at Charles de Percy Cemetery on 6th June each year. Ex Guardsmen,family and friends are welcomed into the community and The French people put on a moving service for all those that fought in Normandy; a get together at The Salle de Fete in Montchamp usually follows the service.

 

Re: 6th Guards Tank Brigade by Patrick Forbes.
On the photographic page opposite page 162 are two B/W photos. The upper one has a group of tank crew men having a 'brew-up'. My Father thinks they mght be 8 troop chaps, S Squadron , 3rd S.G, as the one servicemen on the left, not wearing a cap is Tom Scott, who in an earleir mail, I mentioned lost his twin brother on the opening day of 'Bluecoat'. My Father is believes that Tom possibly worked for Gallagher's (The tobacconists) in Glasgow, hence part of the reason why 8 troop were never short of 'smokes' and always seem to have more than any of the other troops.

 

Diane, in answer to your earlier mail, I have a copy of the 3 S.G war diary but not in particularly good condition. A new copy from T.N.A might be in order. I will be in London within the next week or two, if time allows....

also, your knowledge of the Irish Guards seems extensive; do you know Major Tony Brady? I ask because he was missing from the 6th June commemerations in June, wondering if he was in good health?

 

Hi all,
Couple of points of interest...
1. Eain is correct regarding the 6th June ceremony at St Charles de Percy - we attended this for the first time this year & afterwards had a wonderful time including meeting his father. Eain also kindly asked his father to sign my copy of the Guards vs Hohenstauffen book... and yes, Eain, they were 9th SS (noticed your ??)
2. The "GvH" book is excellent ('though in French only) with some really good seketch maps - ideal for us wargamers!
3. When I was over last year, I took photos of all of the headstones at Hottot cemetary of those Scots Guards who lost lives on Hill 226 - unfortunately, motorway cuts through it, now.
4. I've a copy of the 3Bn Scots Guards war diary from the Hill 226 action, together with Casualty lists, tank names & commanders & "Top Secret to be destroyed" O-Group notes all provided by Scots Guards museum. Need to scan in if people want to see originals, 'though I have typed up into Word... just need to get some more time factored into week to be able to post all!

Regards
Colin

 

Coupled with this Op was Operation Varsity, the airborne drop across the Rhine. My Father's memory of the events, were firstly, the terrific artillery barrage on a scale he had not witnessed before, the smoke from canisters, used to obscure any German's on the East bank of the Rhine getting good visibilty of the west side and the river itself. For my Father's unit, the Rhine crossing was by a chain pontoon, with one tank at a time being ferried over the Rhine. Dad's impressions were that the potoon did not appear very safe, and he did not stay in the turret during the crossing, but climbed on top of the tank till reaching the far bank. Their first objective east of the Rhine was to link up with the American airborne (17th P.I.R) in the woods a few miles to the east. He witnessed some 17th airborne who either got caught in trees and were killed as they struggled to free themselves or that they had been killed between leaving the aircraft and hitting the trees. The link up was not long in coming, with the American airborne lining both sides of the road in the ditch in defensive position.More to follow.

CORRECTION: the text (17th P.I.R) should have read 513 P.I.R.(Parachute Infantry Regiment) sorry.

 

My Father (3 S.G) had the good fortune to have a look around the captured Panther (Cuckoo) which was used by the Brigade (6th Guards Tank) untill it broke down. One thing in particular he found better on the Panther tank (apart from the obvious) was the gun optics, which he considered superior to the Churchill optics. Also the standard issue 'Field Glasses' (Binoculars) he found that the German ones were better than the British Army issue ones.

 

Hopefully, this jpeg will map across to the forum. John Louden was the first soldier to die from 3SG on Operation Bluecoat. Later interred at Hottot les Bagues cemetery.

 

Findlay - Did your father also participate in Operation Veritable the attack on the Reichswald and Cleve in February 1945?

 

Stolpi, yes he did, The battle of Moyland... etc with the 15th Scottish and the Canadians. Don't quote me on this, but most of the time the 3.S.G were in support of 227 Brigade. 2nd Battn Argyle and Sutherland / R.S.F.
He remembers Cleve and the utter destruction wrought by the R.A.F and the difficulty getting through the town; also he was at the railway station, and a train must have been hit, because he said it was rows and rows of bodies laid out awaiting burial.

 

The lead up to Reichswald, Kranenburg etc was flooded terrain, as per the picture in P.Forbes book (6th Guards Tank Brigade), though Lt Stephenson according to my Father (and the book) showed guile and tenacity in finding a route across the terrain up to the edge of the forest, so the momentum could continue.
I had the pleasure of meeting Captain Stephenson (later promotion) approx five years ago. He was living near Wootton Bassett, Wilts and my Father and himself were reminiscing about the war and service in 3 S.G.
Captain Stephenson died approx 3 years ago.

 

Folks, I have tried to get my Father to give his testimony either to the I.W.M or the Tank Museum at Bovington. For whatever reason he is a tad reticent, hence my threads and mails (if a little disjointed). I think he see's his service as unremarkable, but by today's standards, his experiences in life are anything but.
I will continue to add mails/threads and some more pictures, so if anyone has a particular question I will try to get his views/experiences, but he does not know I am loading the info into the public (digital) domain and may get irritated with me if he finds out; but I think ALL the testimonies of ANYONE who served are important, especially as this generation are getting a bit 'thin on the ground'. Thank you. FINDLAY.

 

Findlay
My Father (3 S.G) had the good fortune to have a look around the captured Panther (Cuckoo) which was used by the Brigade (6th Guards Tank) untill it broke down. One thing in particular he found better on the Panther tank (apart from the obvious) was the gun optics, which he considered superior to the Churchill optics. Also the standard issue 'Field Glasses' (Binoculars) he found that the German ones were better than the British Army issue ones.


The German gunnery optics were probably the best in existence at that time although a little over engineered.
Their general purpose binoculars even the plain "dienstglas" ( service binoculars ) in most cases better than ours.
A friend of mine showed me a photo of a well known SS officer with a set of Ross 7x50's and since this have seen several similar photos , guess that using the "other guys" gear from time to time was part of the trophy experience.
using the tank , now that is good pay back !

 

Eain,
Your "snippets" from your father's experiences are tremendously interesting... and important - thank you for sharing them.
Having met you both on 6th June this year at the St Charles event & later at David M's & other veterans & spoken to them, the overwhelming "message" that comes through is that "there was a job to be done, so we went and did it" as you say, they don't think what they did was remarkable, but as I usually say to veterans, them doing what they did, meant that me & my kids haven't had to go through it all again... & that's a remarkable achievement.
Your father's testimony is truly important, perhaps part of his not wanting to share with IWM or Bovington is that whilst bringing back lots of good memories, it also brings back the pain of loss of friends...
Anyway, thanks, again, for posting the testimonies, I'm sure that they are adding lots to the knowledge pool of everyone who is reading them
Cheers
Colin

 

Travel outside Scotland for my Father prior to the war was unheard of; prior to training at Caterham he had never been to England, so Normandie in '44 was a new (if apprehensive) experience. Before Operation Bluecoat, my Father had the chance to visit Bayeux and see the historical town (3 S.G at the time were based2 to 3 miles east of Bayeux. As a gift for his Mother, he bought some cheeses (Brie/Camembert) as these were non existent in their part of Ayrshire. Duly packing them up and sending them home. A few months later Dad got mail from his Mum, thanking him for hi letter and the cheeses, 'but' she said, 'I had to throw them away son as they did not travel well, they had all gone soft and smelt quite strongly!!'
So the first chance to sample Normandie produce was consigned to the bin!

 

When my Father (3 S.G) was in Holland, they had a stint at Valkenburg. Whilst here, they were in a residential suburb and they had the chance to stay in a Dutch families 'outhouse'...a storage shed of sorts.

The family kindly invited the men from the tank in for a meal with them, which the crew kindly accepted. A stew was on offer, but when the men saw the lack of provisions for the meal (the stew consisting of potatoes and apples), they quickly grabbed their supply rations from the tank and added 'Bully Beef' and tinned vegatables to the mix to make a hearty and warming meal.
The family were most appreciative, particularily the Children who had some squares of chocolate for dessert, a delight they had rarely sampled due to the war.

 

In the 3 S.G, were many officers from wealthy land owning families. My Father was very impressed with the Officers he had contact with; although their backgrounds were so far apart in terms of upbringing and opportunities from himself and many of the N.C.O's .
He does remember one Officer had a 'mail' delivery consisting of a hamper from 'Fortnums and Mason', one of the more 'upmarket' shops in London.

But the Officer did not just share the food with fellow officers, but let the men in the troop enjoy a treat as well. A good way to foster camaraderie in their shared existence.

 

'S' squadron's Sgt Major was John Todd. My Father thought he was a very good and able S.S.M.

Prior to his death two years ago, Tim Gilpin former troop leader of 8 troop informed me that John Todd had a succesfull civilian life after the war in the Police Force, finishing at The Chief Constable of Liecestershire Police.

I have been unable to verify this, but if any followers of the forum can verify this, I'd be interested to hear. FINDLAY.