A story about the 8th Army and Cortona, Italy. Any truth in it ?

I use to teach with an American University's Studies Abroad Program in Cortona, Italy. A small hilltown to the West of Perugia and SE of Arezzo..
In a local bar was a photograph of a Sherman, cannot remember the markings but the locals tell a story, more than a few of them, that the town was occupied by a German Company, or two depending on who told it, and inhabitants from towns to the South told the Cortonese that a Polish "unit" was designated to take the town the next morning. The story goes on to say that during the night the vast majority of the Germans left out of the northern gate and headed toward Milan. The remainder, mostly officers awoke and seeing the situation as for sanctuary in a Monastery. The Poles arrive, seeing no opposition leave and later in the day a British administrative unit arrive and set up shop. It was said upon hearing this that the Germans, mostly officers, sent a white flag out to surrender.

A lovely story and one of the tellers was a nun at the same Monastery but I always believed it was product of someone's imagination...............with perhaps a few fragments of reality in it. But a very few. One fellow told me the Americans liberated Cortona but I want to believe the "story".

Has anyone ever heard of this event or was the British army even in the Chianti Valley in position for this to happen. Cortona is a lovely place with a large British population, some permanent, some summer visitors.

Gaines Blackwell,
Auburn, Al
US

 

Ortona was mostly Canadians vs. nazi paras, a very bloody and costly fight.

 

Owen is right as that area was in the British sector both X th and Xiiith corps were involved until 78th Div went off to reinforce

and rest in Egypt whereas 6th Armoured took over and liberated Arezzo - US 5th Army then took over for Florence as they liked

liberating big cities- 1st Canadian did a 180 and went off to start the Gothic line Battles near the Adriatic - leaving 6th Armoured

in the Mountains for the winter-along with the South Africans- 78th with 56th Div came back for the Gothic and 6th Armoured returned

to 8th Army for the spring push…

Cheers

 

Indeed it is Cortona, a hilltown of about 5000 that was a Medici outpost. It has a commanding view of the Chianti Valley, indeed, Hannibal; fought the Romans just West of the lake.

Thanks to Owen for the Ordnance maps. From what I gather the story is possible if not totally plausible but I always wanted to believe it. I rented a house just across from the mentioned Monastery.

Cortona is popular with the British, many having houses or flats there, including Frances Mayes that Owen mentioned. Her nicely filmed but gruesomely adapted screen play, "Under The Tuscan Sun" was largely filmed there.

Is there anyway to determine if any Polish troops were in that area.

Gaines

 

Gaines

The Polish Division was NOT involved with either Xth or Xiii corps attached to the US Army after Rome

They had suffered greatly in their battles for Cassino - and were reinforcing from Poles captured from German units and so

replaced 4th Indian Div on the Adriatic Coast in absorbing these new reinforcements - later they moved up that coast to

capture Ancona and Pesaro before joining 1st Canadian and Vth corps in attacking the Gothic line over the Metauro and finally

left that a battle by being squeezed out by the Canadians at Cattolica……

So that part of your story is neither possible nor plausible as I can give you a hint - I was there …!

Cheers

 

Tom, thanks, I reasoned that it was probably a nice tale handed down and enhanced by time. It would have been a nice story ! I do know there was not a fight over Cortona itself. I have spent a good many summers there and am yet to figure out how the Sherman got to the main square, Piazza Nationale, as no road or gate is wide enough. It is possible a gate was "widened" then put back.

Appreciate all the input, have great memories there . I imagine yours are of a quite different nature. Italy strikes me as favoring the defenders in terrain. Your life has certainly been full and rich in a huge range of experiences both good and difficult. I am honored to make your acquaintance here. Scots sure do cover our world!

Gaines

 

Gaines
there is no question that Scots do cover the world as every corner of it has seen them do their thing - for which the blame lies

in NOT the instruction of the MAN to Moses but rather to the King of Scotland - a far flung relative of mine in the Murrey clan -

" to go forth and teach ye all nations "…

If there are still original signs of ID on the Sherman it might be of interest as many Tank bdes were involved in that general

area such as 6th British Armoured with 26th AB - South African 6th AD - New Zealand AB and British 9th AB all due to salve the ego

of your Gen Mark Clark who stamped his foot to gain Two British Corps - although he hated them - to replace his losses to the

South of France landings nonsense- I often wondered how we managed to win….as the Germans appeared to be easier than our own allies

Cheers- PS - my avatar shows the mailed fist of 6th AD

 

I wouldn't give up the whole story Gaines, just the bit about it being Poles. I know the Kiwis passed through in mid-July, and in fact rested in Cortona, but they can't claim to have liberated it.

 

Ropey

Not surprised as no one claimed to have liberated Cortona as there was NO fight there - a bigger fight was for Arezzo

when all three regiments of 26th Ab were involved- then the Canadians pushed through to Florence and spent a few days trying to
convince Kesselring that they would be the main force to take Florence by throwing empty cigarette packages into the Arno - it

worked as he then brought his main corps of 1st paras - 26Pz's and 29th pz grens over from the coast- as 1st Cdns did their

180 over to Fabriano to start the Gothic line….to help confuse Kesselring we were asked to stop 157- 40 ton Churchill tanks

in small villages to ask if this was the road to Florence - the villagers must have thought we were pretty stupid - then we

did our 180 below Arezzo- stopping at Spoleto for a swim in the coldest pool I have ever nearly drowned in-until the Brigadier

asked why our Tank had broken down so close to the pool - fortunately it was a waste of time to give us jankers…I think he was

envious…

Cheers

 

Well the photo of the Sherman hangs on the wall of Bar Unica, a pleasant place on the main street Via Nationale. I still have friends in and out of Cortona so will try and get some to photograph the photograph. Will pass on what if anything I discover.

Gaines

 

No one seems to have explored the possibility that a rumour was deliberately spread that Poles were about to attack Ortona, with the object of getting the Germans to pull out because of possible retribution (which obviously worked). Possibly a bit of low level Psy-Ops?

Chris

 

Hi Chris

We are talking about CORTONA not Ortona :wink:

 

lets us be perfectly clear in this case - ORTONA was on the Adriatic Coast- and was fought over by the Canadian 1st Division over Christmas 1943

CORTONA was small village to the NORTH of Rome near Arezzo and was involved in the passage of the 5th army attached British Corps' in the July of 1944

bit like getting confused with London and Manchester…

Cheers

 

What another great Italy thread!