A Norman Civilian's Experience with Overlord

The following is an interview that I did with a French civilain survivor of the Normandy Campaign. She was four at the time of the battle. I've lost her name, but will add it later as she is the mother of the director of the Montormel Bunker. She was four at the time of the battle and is a proud old woman now. She held her dachsund through the entire interview and sat tall as so many older French folk do. We will meet her on her family farm this summer on my Normandy tours:

"My parents, who lived in Paris, abandoned me shortly after the German invasion in 1940. I was an infant. My father was sent to Germany to work in a factory in the Ruhr and my mother took up with a German officer. Both of them were lost to me after the war and I have no idea what happened to them. My new family lived on a rich farm outside of Falaise and took me in as one of their own. They had a daughter and she loved me as her own sister. The occuapation was easier for farm folk as we ate very well, except for luxuries such as chocolate. Once, a German officer gave me a big bar of chocolate and some jam. I ran home with it, but my new mother snatched it from me and said it was poisoned. I went back crying to the soldier and he laughed and gave me more, telling me not to tell my mother. Another time, a Waffen SS Colonel came into the local cafe while my family was delivering produce. To everyone's horror, he picked me up and put me on his knee, placing his cap on my head. He smiled sadly and said he had a daughter just my age back in Germany.

When the fighting came, I remember the German retreat most of all. The Germans used civilains as human shields against the air attacks and artillery shelling that pounded them on the Corridor of Death. I remember an allied fighter spraying the road with machine guns. Soldiers, civilains, and horses flew in every direction. A German soldier threw my sister into ditch just before he was ripped in half by bullets from above. He saved my sister's life. We never knew his name.

After the battle, some Canadian troops billeted at our farm. They captured a group of Waffen SS troops. One big Canadian took me on his shoulders and carried me to where the Germans were lined up. He told me to count to three and I did. On three, the Canadians fired several tommy gun bursts into the Germans, killing them. I remember several of the Germans were boys.

After the Canadians left, we worked to clean up the mess of war. It took over a year and the flies for months were as thick as smoke on the beatiful landscape. We couldn't drink the groundwater for nearly a year.

I can remember those days as if they were yesterday. I'm now just over 70 years old and was 4 then, but I will never forget. Especially the German soldier who saved my sister."

 

The following is an interview that I did with a French civilain survivor of the Normandy Campaign. She was four at the time of the battle. I've lost her name, but will add it later as she is the mother of the director of the Montormel Bunker. She was four at the time of the battle and is a proud old woman now. She held her dachsund through the entire interview and sat tall as so many older French folk do. We will meet her on her family farm this summer on my Normandy tours:

"My parents, who lived in Paris, abandoned me shortly after the German invasion in 1940. I was an infant. My father was sent to Germany to work in a factory in the Ruhr and my mother took up with a German officer. Both of them were lost to me after the war and I have no idea what happened to them. My new family lived on a rich farm outside of Falaise and took me in as one of their own. They had a daughter and she loved me as her own sister. The occuapation was easier for farm folk as we ate very well, except for luxuries such as chocolate. Once, a German officer gave me a big bar of chocolate and some jam. I ran home with it, but my new mother snatched it from me and said it was poisoned. I went back crying to the soldier and he laughed and gave me more, telling me not to tell my mother. Another time, a Waffen SS Colonel came into the local cafe while my family was delivering produce. To everyone's horror, he picked me up and put me on his knee, placing his cap on my head. He smiled sadly and said he had a daughter just my age back in Germany.

When the fighting came, I remember the German retreat most of all. The Germans used civilains as human shields against the air attacks and artillery shelling that pounded them on the Corridor of Death. I remember an allied fighter spraying the road with machine guns. Soldiers, civilains, and horses flew in every direction. A German soldier threw my sister into ditch just before he was ripped in half by bullets from above. He saved my sister's life. We never knew his name.

After the battle, some Canadian troops billeted at our farm. They captured a group of Waffen SS troops. One big Canadian took me on his shoulders and carried me to where the Germans were lined up. He told me to count to three and I did. On three, the Canadians fired several tommy gun bursts into the Germans, killing them. I remember several of the Germans were boys.

After the Canadians left, we worked to clean up the mess of war. It took over a year and the flies for months were as thick as smoke on the beatiful landscape. We couldn't drink the groundwater for nearly a year.

I can remember those days as if they were yesterday. I'm now just over 70 years old and was 4 then, but I will never forget. Especially the German soldier who saved my sister."

Firstly, welcome to the forum.

I am a Canadian. Do you have any specifics regarding the Canadian soldiers who apparently murdered the Waffen SS? I assume this was after the murder of Canadian soldiers by the hand of Gen. Kurt Meyer.

 

I will ask her. She was young and it may not be true. And, yes, I, too, assume it was in response to what the Waffen SS had done to the Canadians. The 12 SS Panzer in particular participated in multiple massacres of Canadian soldiers.

I lead a group of American college students to Normandy every year and there is a class associated with the trip. We spend one entire week of class on the Canadian contribution and we visit the Canadian Cemeteries in Normandy. We are always touched, I cry every visit, as the Canadian gravestones have personal messages from the families to the heroes buried there.

I hope you know I mean no slight to the brave Canadians who fought in Normandy. I think most of us understand why many of them showed little quarter to the Waffen SS.

I will try to post the village that she lived in. It could help us determine which Canadian unit did this.

 

By the way, by saying it may not be true. So many historical participants recount events with slight mistakes in oral histories. I suspect, however, that she saw something close to what she recounts, although it may be embellished by time and memory.

 

I will ask her. She was young and it may not be true. And, yes, I, too, assume it was in response to what the Waffen SS had done to the Canadians. The 12 SS Panzer in particular participated in multiple massacres of Canadian soldiers.

I lead a group of American college students to Normandy every year and there is a class associated with the trip. We spend one entire week of class on the Canadian contribution and we visit the Canadian Cemeteries in Normandy. We are always touched, I cry every visit, as the Canadian gravestones have personal messages from the families to the heroes buried there.

I hope you know I mean no slight to the brave Canadians who fought in Normandy. I think most of us understand why many of them showed little quarter to the Waffen SS.

I will try to post the village that she lived in. It could help us determine which Canadian unit did this.

I very much look forward to your findings.

During the war crime trials of Kurt Meyer and Bernhard Siebken ( Lt. Col. Waffen SS ), both claimed that Canadian troops had killed German POW's. They were unable to provide any proof to corroborate their claims of Canadian war atrocities.

Siebken was later hanged in 1949 for shooting Canadian prisoners of war.
Kurt Meyer was brought to trial at Aurich in Germany and was sentenced to death but later reprieved and spent six years in a Canadian jail before being transferred to a prison in Werl,Germany. He was released on parole in 1954. Pity that. And, later died in 1961.

Thank you for taking your students to Normandy. The Canadians fought long and hard to liberate Italy, France, Belgium and Holland.

Cheers

 

Wilhelm Mohnke, the one that got away.

 

Another "Pity that ".
Lived to the ripe old age of 90. Made of Teflon.

 

Casey - while there be much currency in evil deeds living long in memory- I find on reaching back even further than your 74 year old- my own memories don't go that far back as I can only think back to early days at school around six years old - so I think a bigger pinch of salt is required -

as to finding which Canadian unit was in the area that perpetrated the ALLEGED atrocities- we should really get the facts before condemnation as this attitude is all too common " oh I heard it from my brother in law's half sisters cousin when she was at a coffee morning years ago..." .......it's called gossip...even from a 74 year old !
Cheers

 

Tom,

I'm confused. You are calling this gossip? I merely related what she said and wrote that it could be flawed. Actually she says SHE saw this happen, so, no, it isn't gossip, unless you are saying I'm gossiping. That certainly isn't the case. I related what she told me happened and acknowledged that it could be faulty memory. She could even be making up the event. However, she had little reason to. I even added that oral histories are often flawed. What you saw a few days ago isn't clear in your mind to a certainty. I suspect she saw something happen.

And I'll add this. It would be silly to argue that Allied soldiers never massacred German soldiers. Of course, in the heat of battle, some German soldiers were executed. After the brutal fighting that took place in and about Caen, and knowing what the Waffen SS did to Canadians, I'm not surprised something like this could have happened. Allied soldiers would need to have been puritanical angels to have not snapped at times and finished of some prisoners.

Nor could you have read any condemnation in what I wrote about her comments. I, in fact, stated my admiration for the Canadians. I'm a trained historian and would never argue hearsay over fact. But oral histories tend to be messy. I agree that her age at the time was quite young to remember things so. But seeing people cut in half by machine guns might well be something never forgotten.

Having, like many of you, stood in the Canadian Cemetery in Normandy and cried at the personal messages on the graves there, I would never sully those men's names. But I don't consider this to be a crime really. Does this mean that I should consider E.B. Sledge to be a liar or his mates to be criminals for his relating the terrible deeds done by the Marines in the Pacific at times?

 

And I'd like to add, you've lived it as I said to Sapper in a different thread. I have much respect for what you did and your opinion.

I can give another example of a soldier who discussed the murder of German prisoners. Dr. Guy Fortney spoke for me at a forum on the Holocaust last year. He was a family practice doctor in Oak Ridge, Tennessee following the war and a combat medic in the U.S. Army during the conflict. He helped liberate a small concentration camp in Germany. He and the men he served with took no prisoners, at least alive, for a few days after. He swore it was on the orders of senior officers. I guess that is hearsay, at least the part about the officers, but I trust Dr. Fortney as I know him to be an honorable man.

 

Casey
I am not accusing anyone of spreading gossip merely pointing out that memory is fallible and that gossip is easily spread by not attending to facts as you in your profession would agree - by all means trace the source of the atrocities and put the facts to whoever is in authority to do something about it - if true !

Meanwhile even in the heat of Battle civilised behaviour tended to be still uppermost and yes there were some occasions when that was forgotten by both sides - but it was not a common occurrence in my experience mainly in Italy - the main atrocities there were by the enemy against partisans - and for little reason such as the massacre in the Caves of Rome of some 135 civilians - that was sheer savagery by a frustrated enemy.
Cheers

 

May I ask what unit you served with sir? If you served in the Canadian Army, I'd love to do a phone interview of you for my class this Spring. We spend a week of our Normandy class discussing the contribution of Canadians to the war effort from the industrialization of Canada to Italy and Normandy. We won't be visiting the battlefields of Italy.

I have several WW2 veterans speak in class. All of them American, with one German this year. He was a member of the Hitler Youth and then served in the German Army against the Russians. Would you be willing to discuss your experiences with my students over the phone or skype on the computer?

I also want to be clear that a few men losing their tempers and killing some captured Germans in no way compares to the organized brutality of the Waffen SS.

 

And I'd like to add, you've lived it as I said to Sapper in a different thread. I have much respect for what you did and your opinion.

I can give another example of a soldier who discussed the murder of German prisoners. Dr. Guy Fortney spoke for me at a forum on the Holocaust last year. He was a family practice doctor in Oak Ridge, Tennessee following the war and a combat medic in the U.S. Army during the conflict. He helped liberate a small concentration camp in Germany. He and the men he served with took no prisoners, at least alive, for a few days after. He swore it was on the orders of senior officers. I guess that is hearsay, at least the part about the officers, but I trust Dr. Fortney as I know him to be an honorable man.

Caseycobb...
You are talking to a Veteran and a historian of the Italian Campaign.
Tread quietly and with eyes and ears wide open, por favori.

 

Casey
I served with the 145th regiment of the Royal Armoured Corps of the 21st British Tank brigade in support of the 1st Canadian Infantry division from just after their battles of Ortona until they left for Belgium in the February of 1945 - at least the regiment did as I was consigned to various hospitals as my 40 ton Churchill Tank got in the way of those dratted 88.mm's guns attached to the latest mark of Tigers - in the battle for San Martino in the Coriano Ridge area of the Gothic Line - I then finished the war in Austria with the 16/5th Queens Lancers.

would be happy to share some experiences with your students - preferably by PC as my ears are not what they were....
cheers

 

May I ask what unit you served with sir? If you served in the Canadian Army, I'd love to do a phone interview of you for my class this Spring. We spend a week of our Normandy class discussing the contribution of Canadians to the war effort from the industrialization of Canada to Italy and Normandy. We won't be visiting the battlefields of Italy.

I have several WW2 veterans speak in class. All of them American, with one German this year. He was a member of the Hitler Youth and then served in the German Army against the Russians. Would you be willing to discuss your experiences with my students over the phone or skype on the computer?

I also want to be clear that a few men losing their tempers and killing some captured Germans in no way compares to the organized brutality of the Waffen SS.

But, I do look forward to hearing from you on this topic. Which Canadian Regiment? And, to let you know that I do not take it as a slight ...from your earlier post.

 

Tom,

Thank you very much. As I assume you already know, my students think that the European campaign was purely an American adventure, it they know anything about it at all. I'm thinking it would be nice to have several veterans of as many Commonwealth nations as possible speak to them about their involvement.

We can easily arrange a pc interview and you could set the ground rules.

Currently we have these veterans meet with students:
1. PFC Clinton E. Riddle: 325th Glider Infantry attached to the 82 Airborne. Fought from North Africa to Germany. Won seven battle metals, two purple hearts, and did two combat drops. A fine man. 89 Years old and still wears his dress uniform from 1944.
2. Bert Schapel: Entered France six weeks after D-Day. Served in a tank destroyer battalion. Fought all the way to Germany. Has a captured Nazi flag as big as Texas signed by the survivors of his company.
3. John Towles: Engineer on a B-17 who was shot down over France. Hid with a French family for six months. Fell in love with one of their daughters whom he describes as being "pretty as a speckled pup." All of his stories lead back to girls and he tries to kiss the girls in my class.
4. Guy Fortney: Local doctor. Was a combat medic in WWII. Fought from just after D-Day to Germany. Helped liberate a concentration camp. Shows pictures he took at the camp, including Eisenhower touring it.

You, sir, would be a welcom addition to this group.

 

Casey -
your statement that most of your students think the European area was an American adventure - doesn't surprise me as most had their History lessons via Hollywood and as one chap just recently stated - WW2 started on Dec 7 - '41 ! So I know where you are coming from.
That said you have quite a kennel of vets there and I would be happy to participate in correcting the wrongs of Hollywood by stating quite firmly that WW2 started with the invasion of Poland by German troops on September 1st 1939 with Britain and the Commonwealth declaring war from September 3rd and during the first week of that month, and that the first American shot - by ground troops to be fired in the European / African area was on November 8th 1942 at North Africa....

Cheers

 

Thanks Tom. The class will begin in January. I will get back to you on a date for you to speak to my students.

 

Casey - look forward to that...

Cheers

 

While Meyer claimed it, the best fit to the date and location he described was D Coy of the Regina Rifles. To refute him, the prosecution had Maj HS Roberts on hand at the trial, as well as the affidavits of two other ORs from the Reginas. The court ultimately ruled that their evidence was unecessary, as retaliation was not a valid defense.

Affidavits of all three RRRs here:

Kurt Meyer accusations against Canadians (was North Nova Scotia Highlanders History) - MLU FORUM



I very much look forward to your findings.

During the war crime trials of Kurt Meyer and Bernhard Siebken ( Lt. Col. Waffen SS ), both claimed that Canadian troops had killed German POW's. They were unable to provide any proof to corroborate their claims of Canadian war atrocities.