78th Infantry Division - Austria

Discussion in 'Higher Formations' started by Tony56, Mar 26, 2011.

  1. Tony56

    Tony56 Member Patron

    Posting a couple of dad’s photos here as they may appeal to those with 78th Division interests, both have the same note on the reverse which states:

    “26 Group Farewell Party, Sgt's Mess 78 Div HQ, Pörtschach, Austria, Wednesday 30 June 1946”.

    Portschach Farewell Party 1.jpg

    Portschach Farewell Party 2.jpg

    Dad (Sgt GF Anthony, 56th Recce) is sitting on floor and I initially assumed they were all in this regiment, however now not so sure. Although B&W his green/yellow Arm of Service stripe can be made out but looking carefully you can see at least one other (see 3rd from left, back row). Perhaps the photos are therefore sergeants of more than one 78th unit.

    Some questions on photo 1, if anyone is able to assist.

    Firstly, is that a crown above dad’s stripes, is that a staff sergeant?

    Who is the chap 4th from left in the front row? Presumably an officer but his uniform would appear to be black or certainly a lot darker than the others, anyone know the rank?

    Front row far left, and second in from right, have no stripes but have a large round badge on their lower arm, what rank would these be? Better view of badge in photo 2.

    Hopefully of interest to someone out there.
     
  2. Tom Canning

    Tom Canning WW2 Veteran WW2 Veteran

    Ton -
    Love the murals of the Two Types on the walls

    the Three Chevrons and Crown = Staff Sergeant

    Probable RSM in dress unifrom- Regimental Sergeant Major- WO1- the boss !

    Round badge CSM- Company Sergeant major - WO2
    Cheers
     
  3. Drew5233

    Drew5233 #FuturePilot 1940 Obsessive

    Round Badge: Large Crown with Laurels around it will be a CQMS.
     
  4. Tom Canning

    Tom Canning WW2 Veteran WW2 Veteran

    Tony -
    your post took me back a long way as we had to go through Portschach on the way to the interior at Knittelfeld - Judenberg - those crafty RECCE types managed to get their billets one minute from the beach where they had a hard life trying to avoid sunburn.....while we were slogging around catching the bad guys..
    great place for a good restful holiday with Velden one end and Klagenfurt at the other.....Villach not far away ....you should try and get there one day..couple of hours from London - or a three day wander by car would make a fantastic holiday.
    Cheers
     
  5. Recce_Mitch

    Recce_Mitch Very Senior Member

    Tony thanks for sharing some more of your fathers photos

    Cheers
    Paul
     
  6. Ron Goldstein

    Ron Goldstein WW2 Veteran WW2 Veteran

  7. Tony56

    Tony56 Member Patron

    Thanks for the info. I know I should have more respect for a ww2 veteran Tom, but crafty? What's the motto, something about every other **** being behind?
     
  8. Tom Canning

    Tom Canning WW2 Veteran WW2 Veteran

    Tony -
    "Crafty" because they were always pushing and shoving to get the best billets by claiming that there was only the enemy in front - not surprising as they had souped up sports engines and we had to slog along at 15MPH.....
    Cheers
     
  9. Tony56

    Tony56 Member Patron

    Let's not forget the ladies. Inscription reads:

    “26 Group Farewell Party, Sgt's Mess 78 Div HQ, Pörtschach, Austria, Wednesday 30 June 1946,
    502 (ATS) MAC CNF"
     
  10. Tony56

    Tony56 Member Patron

    Sorry, hit wrong button!!

    Portschach Farewell Party 3.jpg
     
  11. 4jonboy

    4jonboy Daughter of a 56 Recce

    Tony-thanks for sharing more photos

    Lesley
     
  12. ttd0

    ttd0 Junior Member

    My grandfather, RAMC, after Dunkirk and time in UK went with the 78th to North Africa and served with it for the rest of the war, ending up in Austria. Was with 217 Field Ambulance. Before embarkation he went through Landing Craft training in Scotland.
     
  13. chrisgrove

    chrisgrove Senior Member

    Posting a couple of dad’s photos here as they may appeal to those with 78th Division interests, both have the same note on the reverse which states:

    “26 Group Farewell Party, Sgt's Mess 78 Div HQ, Pörtschach, Austria, Wednesday 30 June 1946”.

    View attachment 48136

    View attachment 48137

    Dad (Sgt GF Anthony, 56th Recce) is sitting on floor and I initially assumed they were all in this regiment, however now not so sure. Although B&W his green/yellow Arm of Service stripe can be made out but looking carefully you can see at least one other (see 3rd from left, back row). Perhaps the photos are therefore sergeants of more than one 78th unit.

    Some questions on photo 1, if anyone is able to assist.

    Firstly, is that a crown above dad’s stripes, is that a staff sergeant?

    Who is the chap 4th from left in the front row? Presumably an officer but his uniform would appear to be black or certainly a lot darker than the others, anyone know the rank?

    Front row far left, and second in from right, have no stripes but have a large round badge on their lower arm, what rank would these be? Better view of badge in photo 2.

    Hopefully of interest to someone out there.

    Hi Tony56

    Sad to say I disagree with some previous replies.

    I do not really know what the guy in the middle is, but the British Army has never as far as I know had a uniform that dark with an open collar. No 1 Dress has a stand up collar. The Marines have a dark blue uniform with open collar like that, but the badges do not look right to me.

    Three stripes with a crown above (if it is a crown) indeed indicates a SSgt, but would probably mean (in Recce as RAC) an SQMS (Squadron Quartermaster Sergeant) or perhaps a more specialised post within HQ Sqn. SSgt is his rank, but SQMS is his job. Note that a CQMS would be an Infantryman (Company QMS).

    The round badge (crown with laurel wreath round it) - left hand man - would indicate the RQMS (Regimental QMS). SSMs (Squadron Sergeant Majors) have simply a crown on the lower arm (second from right). Same rank of WO2, but different appointments.

    The RSM would have the Royal Arms on his lower arm - possibly the guy who appears to the right of the man in the dark uniform.

    HTH

    Chris
     
  14. bigduke6

    bigduke6 Junior Member

    Hello,
    I own a Dodge D-15 and restored it.
    Color is light stone as found on original.
    Truck has come with British forces into Austria, before it was sold to a civilian north of Vienna.

    Markings for the truck shall be 78th Inf Div.
    Can anybody recall the correct number of the regiment on the fender,
    if I want to make it an engineer truck?
     
  15. Owen

    Owen -- --- -.. MOD

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  16. bigduke6

    bigduke6 Junior Member

    Thank you very much, will keep you updated.
    Erwin
     
  17. Crosbygirl

    Crosbygirl Junior Member

    Hello,
    Just discovered that my late father JAMES RICHARD MIDDLETON left his original posting (Gunner Driver) with 110/39 LAA Regiment, Royal Artillery and was transferred to 1st Battalion, East Surrey Regiment, who were in 11th Infantry Brigade, 78th Infantry Division. In the winter of 1945 he was with the V (BR) Corps who were themselves under command of the British 8th Army. Dad was at the battle for the Argenta Gap 12-19 April in the final phase of the war. I suspect he was a driver in the East Surrey Motor Transport Platoon moving troops, supplies and ammunition. When the war ended his Battalion was moved to Austria.
    In May 1945 he was posted to AFHQ in the Staff and Services pool that I think was in Vallach. In August he was again re-posted, this time to HQ 55 Area Staff and Services Pool.

    Is anyone able to provide me with further information please? Is it likely that I might be able to find War Diaries at TNA on the aforementioned V (BR) Corp and the East Surrey Motor Transport Platoon?

    My thanks for anyone's assistance, it will be very much appreciated.
    Best wishes to all
    Ann
     
  18. Tullybrone

    Tullybrone Senior Member

    Hi Ann,

    When your father was in the motor transport platoon he was still part of 1st East Surrey - likely part of HQ company. Infantry Battalions did not maintain War Diaries at either company or platoon level - only at Battalion level but that might reference a Specific Company or Platoon activity in a daily narrative if appropriate.

    Both 1st East Surrey and the higher level 5th British Corps War Diaries will be available at British National Archives - although I doubt you would glean much from the higher level diary about the East Surrey Motor Transport Platoon. Several forum members offer a WD look up and copy service - drop either Drew5233 or PsyWar.Org (Lee) a Personal Message to discuss your requirements.

    Good Luck

    Steve
     
  19. Crosbygirl

    Crosbygirl Junior Member

    Hello Steve,
    Thank you so much for your early reply. I will certainly get one of your recommended members, who use the TNA, to look into this for me, as I am unable to do this for myself. I will check out this tomorrow when I have more time.
    My thanks again for your kind input and helpful information.
    Best wishes
    Ann
     
  20. Tullybrone

    Tullybrone Senior Member

    Hi Ann,

    You’re welcome.:)

    You may be lucky and discover that either Andy or Lee have already copied 1st East Surrey WD for the period you are interested in.

    Steve
     
    Drew5233 and Crosbygirl like this.

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