65 Anti-Tank Reg't RA - April 1945 WD?

Discussion in 'Royal Artillery' started by Chris C, Apr 26, 2021.

  1. Chris C

    Chris C Canadian Patron

    Hi all,

    I was wondering if anyone happened to have the war diary for 65 (Norfolk Yeomanry) A/Tk Reg't for April 1945?

    On April 5 4KOSB were subject to a "blue on blue" incident in which friendly SPs shelled some buildings they had occupied. (Described in Peter White's With The Jocks.)

    I had thought that the SPs would have been Archers of 54 Anti-Tank Reg't. There is no mention of such an incident in their WD (but would there be?). One of its batteries are mentioned as in support of 155 Brigade on 3 April but then there's nothing.

    However according to Andy Aitcheson on twitter, they were in support of 7 Armoured Div by that date. So it's not completely impossible that 65 A/TK Reg't were involved. I was wondering if anyone happened to have their war diary for that month?

    I expect we will never actually get to the bottom of it. Also, I should note, I am not trying to assign any blame, just try to create a fuller picture in my head of what happened.
     
  2. JDKR

    JDKR Member

    65th Anti-Tank Regiment RA was 7th Armoured's wheeled and tracked anti-tank regiment. Although I may be wrong, I am not aware of brigades being allocated anti-tank assets from their parent divisions when attached to another division. This was even less likely for 155 Brigade as the threat from enemy armour in April 1945 was low and the brigade could easily be looked after by 65th ATk Regt. Sadly I do not have a copy of the regt's WD for April 1945. However, for the same reasons as yourself, I looked at the WD a while ago but it was so thin in terms of information that I did not copy the relevant pages. I suspect you are right and we will never get to the bottom of why it happened. Fog of war, incompetence, battle fatigue? Who knows.
     
    Last edited: Apr 27, 2021
    Chris C likes this.
  3. AB64

    AB64 Senior Member

    Chris C likes this.
  4. Chris C

    Chris C Canadian Patron

    I think that clinches it, thank you.
     
  5. AB64

    AB64 Senior Member

    "The history of the Headquarters Royal Artillery, 52nd Lowland Division during the German War 1939-1945" (snappy title) Mentions 304 A Tk Bty being attached to 7th Armoured to help force a crossing at Ibbenburen which ties in with 4th KOSB location in the War Diary so a possible candidate battery
     
    Wapen and Chris C like this.
  6. Chris C

    Chris C Canadian Patron

    "When life you gives you lemons"... I'm not sure how you make a great title when you are writing the history of the division's RA HQ. :)

    I can check the anti-tank regiment's war diary to see about corroborating evidence. When I did look there was nothing mentioned for April 5th itself.
     
    AB64 likes this.
  7. Chris C

    Chris C Canadian Patron

    54 Anti-Tank Regiment's war diary does mention 304 A/Tk Bty's troops (G, H, I) supporting 155 Brigade units (7 Cams and 5 KOSB) on 4 April.
     
  8. Wapen

    Wapen Active Member

    Did you have any joy? I'm scraping together scraps from 52 Div in Op Veritable so any tips welcome.
     
  9. Wapen

    Wapen Active Member

    Ehup AB64,
    I can't find this book for sale anywhere so I'm faced with a long trip to Brit Library. This usually ends with me finding nothing of any use. Do you know if there's a handy chapter on Op Veritable? And could you be tempted to share it? I know Stolpi would like a look too. A polite "no" will not offend.
     
    stolpi likes this.
  10. AB64

    AB64 Senior Member

    I'll look it out later today and do some scans
     
    Wapen and Chris C like this.
  11. Chris C

    Chris C Canadian Patron

    I don't think so, but I do have the war diary (daily events anyway) of 54th Anti-Tank Regiment which was 52nd Div's unit and can share.
     
    Wapen likes this.
  12. Wapen

    Wapen Active Member

    Great! I've got some 52 Div scraps to trade. About to get a copy of the pricey HLI book. : )
     
  13. AB64

    AB64 Senior Member

    Here you go, let mw know if they aren't clear - I had a fair bit of messing around with resolution and resizing to get them to upload so they aren't as clear as I'd have liked

    IMG_20211016_0001.jpg IMG_20211016_0002.jpg IMG_20211016_0003.jpg IMG_20211016_0004.jpg IMG_20211016_0005.jpg IMG_20211016_0006.jpg IMG_20211016_0007.jpg IMG_20211016_0008.jpg IMG_20211016_0009.jpg
     
    Wapen and stolpi like this.
  14. stolpi

    stolpi Well-Known Member

    Great find AB64 !! Do you also have the chapter dealing with Op Blackcock (January 1945). Woud be much obliged if you would share these pages too.
     
    Wapen likes this.
  15. Chris C

    Chris C Canadian Patron

    No need for a trade really - but I know a fellow on Twitter who would probably be interested in exchanging all kinds of material. Ok if I put him in touch with you?
     
  16. AB64

    AB64 Senior Member

    Here you go

    IMG_20211017_0001.jpg IMG_20211017_0002.jpg IMG_20211017_0003.jpg IMG_20211017_0004.jpg IMG_20211017_0005.jpg IMG_20211017_0006.jpg
     
    Wapen, Andy Ait, stolpi and 2 others like this.
  17. stolpi

    stolpi Well-Known Member

    Thank you so much !!
     
  18. Wapen

    Wapen Active Member

    Cheers AB64. That's beautiful! Thanks very much. It's filled in a few awkward gaps... but made me question a few more... and has a added two whole sentences to the thesis. The WW2Talk section of my acknowledgements is getting towards being a chapter in its own right. Please PM me if you'd like your real name immortalized in something nobody will ever read.
    Pints owed.
     
    stolpi and Chris C like this.
  19. Wapen

    Wapen Active Member

    A Twitter link might break me but let's give it a go! Thanks again.
     
  20. AB64

    AB64 Senior Member

    BD blouse belonging to Lt Col Todhunter who was CO of 54th until he was injured 6th January 1945 - he had his arm broken the cause was believed to be a 50 cal round fired from a passing B17 which ricochet

    P1030001.JPG

    Edit to change from 65th to 54th Anti-Tank
     
    Last edited: Oct 20, 2021
    Wapen and Chris C like this.

Share This Page