4th (Durham) Survey Regiment, RA

Hi all,

I am looking for information on the 4th (Durham)
Survey Regiment Royal Artillery. Any informatiom
whatsoever would be great.

Regards
Kieron

 

I have no infomation regarding this unit. However I am very interested in it as my grandfather serverd with them during the second world war, and I would love to know more.

 

4th durham survey RA

 

Thanks mate , but ive dome all the research I can on the net. I do know he was in North Africa for a lot of the war and he was shipped out in 1939/1940, but he also went to greece or crete, syria, iraq, palestine towards the end of the war he was in india and burma. Im planning to get this all down somwewhere, as after listening to his stories for years , i think its about time.

 

Short History of the 4th Durham Survey Regiment Royal Artillery
By the Commanding Officer, Lt.-Col. J.T. Whetton, D.S.O., O.B.E., M.C.

This Unit was formed in January, 1937 under the Durham County T.A.A.F. Association with headquarters at Gateshead-on-Tyne and was embodied there on the outbreak of war.
In May, 1940 the regiment moved to the South of England and came under command of 4th Corps.
In November, the Unit embarked for the Middle East and on arrival in Egypt came under command of G.H.Q.
Advance parties contacted I troop 6 Survey Regiment at the first battle of Tobruk. At the end of this campaign in Western Desert, I Troop rejoined the 4th.
On 13th January, 1941, “Y” Survey Troop was dispatched to Eritrea for flash spotting and survey and “R” Sound Ranging Troop entrained for that theatre of war on 13th February, 1941.
The two Troops fought throughout to the successful conclusion of the campaign and then returned to Egypt.
The Regiment with No.1 Survey Troop attached, less “Y” Survey and “R” Sound Ranging Troops sailed for Greece on 1st April, 1941, and after several deployments under the command of the Australian Corps, was evacuated to Egypt via Crete.
“Y” Survey Troop was now operating in the Western Desert and a composite battery of Flash Spotters and Sound Rangers served in Tobruk throughout the siege.
Later in 1941, the whole Regiment was placed under command of the newly formed Eighth Army and moved onwards through the battles of the Omars, relief of Tobruk, siege of Bardia and Sollum to Benghazi and El Agheila followed by the withdrawal to Gazala.
At this juncture R.H.Q. and one battery placed under command of Ninth Army operated from the Turkish border to the South of Palestine.
One battery remained in Western Desert and had the misfortune to be captured in Torbruk. The other Battery then returned to Egypt and proceeded to El Alamein, being joined later by R.H.Q. and a newly trained Battery.
Being the only Survey Regiment in Eighth Army, it covered the whole front from the Mediterranean to the Quattra depression, a distance of 25 miles.
After Alamein the Regiment advanced with 30 Corps through North Africa to Tunisia, completing the African campaign under 10 Corps.
The Regiment was again allocated to 30 Corps in the Eighth Army for operations in Sicily and landed there with the 51st Highland Division on “D” Day and at the conclusion of this campaign was responsible for the artillery survey preliminary to storming of Italy.
In December, 1943, the Regiment returned to the United Kingdom and was with the first contingent of 50th Northumbrian Division to land in Normandy on “D” Day.
Composite groups of the Regiment operated with the Guards Armoured Division and 11th Armoured Division in the brilliant advance of 30 Corps through France and Belgium to capture Brussels and Antwerp and thence to continue the pursuit to the North of Nijmegen in Holland in the attempt to capture Arnhem.
The Regiment continued in the Victorious march of 30 Corps across the Rhine to the final collapse of the German Army on V.E. Day.

The Honours and Awards included: 1 D.S.O., 1 O.B.E., 4 M.B.E, 10 M.Cs. and 1 Bar, 1 D.C.M., 12 M.Ms., 1 B.E.M., 24 Mentions in Despatches and a number of Allied decorations.


Above is short history taken from a Welcome Home Banquet programme held on the 6th September 1946. Just goes to show never give up on your search for information 2005 I started looking in to this

 

Above is short history taken from a Welcome Home Banquet programme held on the 6th September 1946. Just goes to show never give up on your search for information 2005 I started looking in to this


Hi Kieron,
have you been in touch with the 4th Durham Survey Rgt. Association. I was in contact with the late Tom Fairnington several years ago,but Vic Gray continued with the newsletters after Tom passed away.
Last time I was in touch with him he was rather ill so I am not sure he is still around.
The Regiment came up a few months ago in a contact with a chap called Jim Whetton.
I will P.M. you his contact details.


Brian

 

The Regiment came up a few months ago in a contact with a chap called Jim Whetton.
I will P.M. you his contact details.


Cheers Brian, I really appreciate that, thank you. I am guessing that
if that is the same Jim Whetton than he was the Commanding Officer
of the Regiment at the time. I think he'll be interested in some of the photos I have in my collection, they are of the voyage out from
Liverpool to Egypt on board the Reina del Pacifico.

Thanks again Brian

Cheers
Kieron

 

I thought I'd share these three pictures with
you as I thought they were very interesting.

Picture 1 & 2 are of the conditions that the
men of the 4th Durham Survey Regt RA lived
in while at Tobruk in December 1941. No
wonder the men who were there during the
seige were nicknamed the rats of Tobruk.
Tou can clearly see they were living in
holes/caves in the rock.





And picture 3 is of a couple of surveyors from the 4th Durham at
Tobruk carrying their surveying from underneath their station.
Apparently the thing over the surveying equipment was a becon
to help with identification by other surveyors.

 

Kieron -
I'll bet that printer who did the welcome banquet brochure was fired ...or not paid as he managed to put the 1939 - 45 Star ribbon bass akwards
Chers

 

Is there anyone following this old thread?

My father in law was BQMS C E Hird of 48 Battery ...


Regards

Robin and Margaret (nee Hird)

 

There's a self-printed history of the regiment called 'Z Location'.

All the best

Andreas

 

You need to get hold of Mangilli-Climpson's 'Larkhill's Wartime Locators - RA Survery in hte Second Wold War' published in 2007. He covers all the UK and Indian survey regts in great detail. It's around 700 pages.

 

World War II----------------------Surveyors WWII





Z Location or Survey in War


The story of the 4th Durham Survey Regiment RA by Lt Col JT Whetton DSO, OBE, MC, TD and Lt Col RH Ogden MC, TD

 

I'm reading the personal diary of BQMS Hird C E for 1942. Where can we find out more about the 4th Durham Survey who were in Syria from the and of February to June 1942?

Many entries are about the tedium of being responsible for stores .. one gem is Xmas Dinner .. it arrived with the RSM on 13 March and was duly served up on March 15th by the Officers and Sgts.... shortly after comes the entry for Easter " WOG Christmas"!

Many references to Capt Balfour including him joining in the Sgts drinking sessions. We went to John Balfour's funeral a couple of years ago and Margaret wore he father's medals ..

know of only one man left from 4th Durham ...Maurice Howard (captured in fall of Tobruk 1942 and so not back o be Margaret's godfather in 1945) spoke to him in mid December.


Robin and Margaret (nee Hird)

 

Hi - Some of these files may be of interest if you can get to the National Archives:

WO 169/4684 4 Survey Regiment (Durham) 1942 Jan.- Dec.

WO 169/4685 4 Survey Regiment (Durham) 1 Battery 1942 Sept.- Dec.

WO 169/4686 4 Svy. Regt. (Durham) 'A' Tp. 1942 July- Dec.

WO 169/4687 4 Svy. Regt. (Durham) 'R' Tp. 1942 Sept.- Dec.

WO 169/4688 4 Svy. Regt. (Durham) 'X' Tp. 1942 Dec.

WO 169/4689 4 Svy. Regt. (Durham) 'Y' Tp. 1941 Nov.- 1942 Dec.

WO 169/4690 4 Survey Regiment (Durham) 2 Battery 1942 Feb.- June, Oct.- Dec.

WO 169/4691 4 Svy. Regt. (Durham) 'B' Tp. 1942 Jan.- June, Sept.- Dec.

WO 169/4692 4 Svy. Regt. (Durham) 'S' Tp. 1942 Jan.- June, Oct.- Dec.

 

Hi.. I've just read this thread as I was looking for details about my late father who was captured in Tobruk. I have managed to get someone to load up his army docs if you'd like to have a look at them. Not sure how that happens -bit of a Luddite I'm afraid, but my user name is SueG if you need it.
Regards
Sue

 

We have a copy of the Nominal Roll for the 4th Durham Survey Regiment - "Compiled from official records (Pt. II Orders)" - dated May 1946.

We are happy to do look ups for anyone interested in the men who served. You can post a message on the forum or send a private note. While we rty to respond promptly we are still working shepherds and some times of year are very busy .. like now with lambing ....

Here are some notes about the Nominal Roll and it's contents.

It was compiled as the initial address book for the Old Comrades Association in 1946.
On the cover it states "who served from 31 December 1940 to V.J. Day" however the index gives a different date range (see below) some individuals who were posted from the original TA unit before 12/40 are included.

There are five parts

I Roll of Honour.
Lists 80 men who were killed or died. Column Headings are Regimental Number (blank for officers), Name, Rank, Casualty (examples are KIA,DOW, Pre Died while POW, Accident, Killed in Action at Sea and various medical ones eg Dysentry), Place (eg ME, POW, WD) and date.

II Directory of all O.R's who served in RG from 1939 to V.E. Day
Column headings Army No., Rank, Name and Address, Date of Joining (entered as 'B' if they landed in Egypt in December 1940), Remarks (examples are POW with date, Wounded with date, some medals)

III Directory of attached personnel.
Column headings as for II

IV Directory of all Officer's who served in RG from 1939 to V.E. Day
Column headings Name, Last known rank, Pers. No and date of joining, Home address, Remarks (as for part II)

V Directory of attached officers.
Columns as for Part V

Happy to help

Robin

 

We have a copy of the Nominal Roll for the 4th Durham Survey Regiment - "Compiled from official records (Pt. II Orders)" - dated May 1946.

We are happy to do look ups for anyone interested in the men who served.

Hi Robin - Any mention of a Gunner George Edward Evans. I have his service number if you have more than one match.

Cheers
Andy

 

You need to get hold of Mangilli-Climpson's 'Larkhill's Wartime Locators - RA Survery in hte Second Wold War' published in 2007. He covers all the UK and Indian survey regts in great detail. It's around 700 pages.

Cheers- Just ordered a copy.

 

Hi Robin - Any mention of a Gunner George Edward Evans. I have his service number if you have more than one match.

Cheers
Andy

Two Evans G. E. listed

Reg. No. 986328 Gnr Evans G.E., address - none, Joined "B", Remarks P.O.W. 20.6.42
"B" for joining means Landed with Regiment in Egypt in December 1940

Reg. No. 1096382 Dvr. I/C. Evans G.E., address - none, Joined 14.11.41, Remarks P.O.W. 20.6.42

So both were captured in the fall of Tobruk. The second one is SueG's father.

Vic Gray (L/Sgt) was also captured at Tobruk and wrote up his story. When Jim Whetton republished his uncle's history of the regiment in 2004 he was trying to get Vic to put the memoirs online. Seems this has not happened but there is a deposit listed at the IWM. Private Papers of V Gray MBE | Imperial War Museums
" Memoir, diary and other documents relating to his service with the 4th (Durham) Survey Regiment RA during the Second World War."

Regards

Robin