4th Bn Northumberland Fusiliers

Discussion in 'British Army Units - Others' started by Dean Darvill, Jul 14, 2022.

  1. Dean Darvill

    Dean Darvill Active Member

    Hello,

    I am researching my Grandfather

    Fusilier Albert Edward Hopkins
    6914348
    4th Battalion Royal Northumberland Fusiliers
    Enlisted Rifle Brigade Army Reserve Militia 15th July 1939.
    Transferred to Royal Northumberland Fusiliers January 1940.
    Served Overseas BEF 22.1.40 to 20.5.40
    Missing 21.5.40 to 31.7.40
    Germany POW 1.8.40 to 25.4.45
    POW Camp Stalag XXA. Torun, Poland
    Known to have been a motor cycler rider or dispatch rider
    Either captured at the Battle of Arras but family history said that my grandfather was captured at Dunkirk during the retreat after ditching his motorcycle and getting a ride in a truck that was ambushed and where he was possibly the only survivor.
    He was part of the forced PoW march from Dunkirk
    He was also force marched from Stalag XXa Thorn back into germany the winter of 1944-45

    I have a copy of the 4th battalion war diary and am awaiting a copy of his POW records but would like to trace what company and platoon he was in, in both in the 4th battalion and the rifle brigade
     
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  2. Dean Darvill

    Dean Darvill Active Member

    On Enlistment to the Rifle Brigade 20220712_143948.jpg 20200722_161408.jpg
    On return to the UK
     
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  3. Tullybrone

    Tullybrone Senior Member

    Hi,

    Welcome to the forum.

    Hopefully members may post his entries in the official casualty lists available on FMP.

    You ought to consider applying for his service records from U.K. MOD via this link -

    Request records of deceased service personnel

    The current waiting time is a year due to covid backlogs. It costs £30.

    You should consider applying to Swiss Red Cross for copies of his POW papers when the quarterly enquiry window opens again for a couple of hours 8am Geneva time 26th September 2022. A pop up enquiry form opens up that you need to complete speedily as the enquiry window can close after 90 minutes. In pre Covid times you would get a reply in the post no less than 4 months later. It is a free service.

    You could research the National Archives site to see if he completed a POW questionnaire on his repatriation to U.K. and to see if his German POW Central Registry index card has been made available in WO416.

    Good Luck

    Steve
     
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  4. Dean Darvill

    Dean Darvill Active Member

     
  5. Dean Darvill

    Dean Darvill Active Member

    Many thanks for your reply,

    I am waiting for his POW record from the National Archive. I plan to request his military record from MoD. Didn't know about the Red Cross records so will also try that.
     
  6. Rich Payne

    Rich Payne Rivet Counter Patron 1940 Obsessive

    I have a lot of information on 4 RNF with the BEF. They were the motorcycle battalion of a Motor Division and had a reconnaissance rôle with an establishment of 99 Norton sidecar outfits and 43 solos which also seem to be have been Nortons, based on photographic evidence. They were extensively photographed on exercise in France in March 1940 and then again when entering Belgium at Herseaux on 10th May.

    IMG_0785.JPG
     
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  7. Dean Darvill

    Dean Darvill Active Member

    Thank you for your reply,

    I have a copy of the war diary, haven't read through it properly yet but want to try and identify what company even platoon my grandfather was in so I can match his movements with the company movements listed in the War Diary
     
    Last edited: Jul 14, 2022
  8. Tullybrone

    Tullybrone Senior Member

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  9. Dean Darvill

    Dean Darvill Active Member

  10. Rich Payne

    Rich Payne Rivet Counter Patron 1940 Obsessive

    They were pretty much a composite by the end.

    Do you know this document ? As a Motorcycle battalion, they used a slightly different system and companies were 'HQ', 'X', 'Y' and 'Z' . It's rare to find reference to 'Other Ranks' in surviving documents.

    photofunny.net_.jpeg



    Your best hope is that he was captured early on and completed a questionnaire detailing the location.
     
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  11. Dean Darvill

    Dean Darvill Active Member

    Thank you for your reply.
    I have not seen that document and was going to read through the war diary and try and work out who commanded the various elements of the battalion. Have searched the National Archive for POW questionaires and found no reference to him. From reading the war diary I think he was more than likely in Y coy as family history has it his motorcycle/ motorcycle combination was destroy and one Y coy platoon seem to have lost all of theirs on the day he was captured
     
  12. Trux

    Trux 21 AG

    Dean,

    The following is not exactly what you asked for but I hope it may be useful and/or interesting. This was written some 25 years ago and was posted on the long defunct Trux website. Reconnaissance units have long been an interest of mine.


    MOTOR CYCLE BATTALION
    War Establishment II/1931/12D/1

    The Motorcycle Battalion was introduced in 1938/39 as the reconnaissance unit for the new Motor Divisions. Several Territorial Divisions were earmarked for conversion to this new type of formation. Each division would have two fully motorised infantry brigades plus supporting arms and services. The Motor Division idea was abandoned but the motorcycle units were formed and used in France.

    The first three units converted to Motorcycle Battalions were TA infantry battalions
    1 Queen Victoria’s Rifles for 1st London Division.
    4 Royal Northumberland Fusiliers for the 50th Northumbrian Division
    5 Loyal Regiment for 55th West Lancashire Division

    In 1939 each of the Territorial Army Divisions was to be duplicated. This was not fully achieved but 2 Queen Victoria’s Rifles was formed as the motorcycle battalion of 2 London Division.

    The first War Establishment table does not seem to have been issued until November 1939. This was WE II/1931/12D/1. However there was a Training Booklet issued in July 1939. There was also a peace establishment which differs in many small respects from the War Establishment
    - there were only eight scout cars instead of the later twenty two
    - there was an anti tank platoon with Boyes anti tank rifles. This was later dispersed to platoons.
    - Transport consisted of a total of seventeen 15cwt, one 30cwt and two 8cwt.
    This was all rather notional since the equipment did not exist anyway.

    There is an excellent series of photographs in the Imperial War Museum showing 4 Royal Northumberland Fusiliers parading with their vehicles

    In many ways the motorcycle battalion was nearer to the concept and organisation of the old cavalry reconnaissance units. The motorcycle combinations had a good cross country performance and could if necessary be manhandled over obstacles. They were capable of operating away from roads to a greater extent than the light tanks and armoured cars. They were also able to operate dismounted in the style of the cavalry. Two men would normally fight on foot while one man remained with the machine. However all the personnel of a platoon could leave the machines and fight as an infantry platoon.

    In an advance the motorcycles would lead the division. They would seize key points such as crossroads and bridges and hold them until heavier forces arrived. They would also protect the flanks from surprise attack. In defence the motorcycle unit would form a screen which would both give early warning of an enemy advance and delay that advance with roadblocks and ambushes.

    Personnel
    Lieutenant Colonel, Commanding Officer
    Major. Second in Command
    3 X Major, Company Commanders
    Captain, Adjutant
    4 X Captain
    Quartermaster
    12 X Subaltern

    Regimental Serjeant Major
    Regimental Quartermaster Serjeant
    4 X Company Serjeant Major
    3 X Warrant Officer Class III
    4 X company quartermaster serjeants
    pioneer serjeant
    transport serjeant
    provost serjeant
    serjeant cook
    19 X serjeant
    41 X corporal
    468 X private

    Attached
    Medical Officer RAMC
    Armourer RAOC
    5 X fitter, motor vehicle RAOC

    Tradesmen
    blacksmith
    bricklayer
    2 X carpenter and joiner
    corporal driver operator
    14 X driver operator
    17 X driver mechanic
    2 X equipment repairers
    mason
    5 X technical storeman
    5 X motor mechanic

    Non tradesmen
    19 X batman
    6 X batman driver
    butcher
    6 X clerk
    12 X cook
    70 X driver IC
    medical orderly
    38 X motorcycle orderly
    officers mess cook
    3 X officers mess servant
    3 X orderly
    2 X regimental police
    postman
    4 X sanitary duties
    25 X signaller
    5 X storeman
    13 X stretcher bearer
    water dutyman

    plus
    40 X corporal
    211 X private

    Note that at this early period officers had a batman each. There are batmen for the Medical Officer and the Regimental Serjeant Major included in the figure given.

    Because of the shortage of officers one platoon in each company was commanded by a Warrant Officer Grade III. This was a rank introduced to enable serjeants to be promoted to command a platoon.

    Vehicles
    43 X motorcycle
    99 X motor cycle combination
    1 X car 4 seater
    8 X 8cwt GS
    16 X 8cwt Wireless
    27 X 15cwt GS
    1 X 15cwt office
    1 X 15cwt water
    22 X scout car
    12 X 30cwt 6 X 4 lorry

    Weapons and ammunition
    176 X pistol 12 rounds of ammunition per man 1,056 rounds of ammunition in reserve
    399 X rifle 50 rounds of ammunition per man 41,000 rounds of ammunition in reserve
    23 X Anti tank rifle 200 rounds of ammunition per gun 920 rounds of ammunition in reserve
    48 X Bren gun including
    5 for AA defence 100 rounds of ammunition per gun 2,500 rounds of ammunition in reserve
    27 with mc platoons 100 rounds of ammunition per gun 13,500 rounds of ammunition in reserve
    16 with scout cars 700 rounds of ammunition per gun 12,800 rounds of ammunition in reserve
    9 X 2” mortar with
    High Explosive 9 rounds of ammunition per gun
    Smoke 14 rounds of ammunition per gun 54 rounds of ammunition in reserve
    Signal 40 rounds of ammunition per gun 162 rounds of ammunition in reserve
    22 X signal pistol 12 rounds of ammunition per gun 132 rounds of ammunition in reserve
    144 X hand grenades 1 box of twelve per motorcycle platoon and 3 boxes of twelve in reserve

    Note
    Pistols were issued more widely than in most units. Officers, Regimental Serjeant Major, solo motorcyclists, drivers of motorcycle combinations and scout cars all carried pistols.

    Signal flares were in four colours, white, red, yellow and green. Equal numbers of each were carried.


    There was also an attached Signals Section Royal Signals. This was concerned mainly with the charging and delivery of batteries for the battalion’s wireless sets. Early sets used a lot of power and reconnaissance units were expected to be in static positions with the wireless sets in use, if only on listening watch. The early wireless trucks lacked the means to charge batteries. Signals personnel could also maintain wireless sets and carry out minor repairs.

    Signals section RS
    11 men
    1 X 15cwt GS for delivery of batteries
    1 X 3ton GS for charging and maintaining batteries.

    No Light Aid Detachment, Royal Army Ordnance Corp, is listed in the establishment tables but units in France did have one attached. Details are from War Diaries.

    Light Aid Detachment RAOC
    13 men
    1 X motorcycle
    1 X 2 seater car
    1 X 3ton 6 X 4 Breakdown Gantry lorry
    1 X 3ton 6 X 4 Stores lorry

    The RASC provided two 3ton GS lorries for carrying stores. These did not normally travel with the battalion.


    Battalion Headquarters
    The battalion headquarters was small, only 25 men in all. It contained only those personnel required to plan and command. The Commanding Officer was a Lieutenant Colonel and he was provided with a four seater car. This was usually a Humber but others were also used.

    The Commanding Officer was assisted by his three operational officers, the adjutant, the technical officer and liaison officer. The signal officer would normally form part of the headquarters group as well although he is listed with the signals platoon. The Adjutant would travel with the Commanding Officer.

    The Adjutant was the battalion staff officer. His operational functions were
    1. To record the Commanding officers verbal orders and to confirm them to those to whom they had been issued.
    2. To implement the Commanding Officers orders, plans and policies.
    3. To organise the battalion office.

    The Liaison Officers role was to assist the Commanding Officer by
    1. Collating all available information, including that from the battalion’s forward units and patrols and from Brigade Headquarters.
    2. Maintaining situation maps, monitoring messages and reports.
    3. Briefing the Commanding Officer on the position and intentions of friendly and enemy units.
    The Liaison Officer would be required to visit forward position if required to verify or amplify information.

    The Signal Officer was responsible for arranging communications from the battalion headquarters to the companies and to the battalion rear headquarters. Although shown on organisation tables as being in the headquarters company with the signals platoon he was very much a part of the battalion headquarters. Signals were dispersed throughout the battalion.

    These three officers shared the manning of the battalion command post. Although each also had their own responsibility they had to be sufficiently aware of each others duties to be able to operate flexibly and interchangeably. At least one of them was always on duty.

    The Technical Officer was not usually a watch keeping officer. His responsibility was to maintain the battalion’s vehicles and to advise the Commanding Officer on the mechanical state of the battalion’s vehicles.

    The Second in Command was a Major. His responsibility was the administration of the battalion. He would oversee all non tactical matters, leaving the Commanding Officer and his staff free to plan and implement tactical matters. The Second in Command had an 8 cwt truck and was based at the rear headquarters or echelon of the battalion.

    The Regimental Serjeant Major was responsible for the control of the headquarters personnel and for the layout of the headquarters area. He arranged for the defence of the headquarters area, posted sentries and was responsible for the distribution of reserve ammunition. He also assisted with the distribution of food to forward units. The Regimental Serjeant Major was also responsible for the regimental police.


    Lieutenant Colonel, Officer Commanding
    Major, Second in Command
    Captain, Adjutant
    Subaltern, Technical Officer
    Subaltern Liaison Officers
    Regimental Serjeant Major
    provost serjeant
    intelligence Serjeant
    serjeant fitter RAOC
    2 X clerk
    5 X driver IC
    5 X orderly
    2 X regimental police
    2 X rifleman/private


    Organisation
    4 seater car
    Commanding Officer, Adjutant, orderly, driver IC

    8cwt truck 1
    Major Second in Command, orderly, driver IC

    8cwt truck 2
    Technical Officer, clerk, serjeant fitter RAOC, driver IC

    15 cwt office truck
    Regimental Serjeant Major, serjeant clerk, clerk, orderly, driver IC

    15cwt truck
    Liaison Officer, 2 X rifleman, driver IC
    Carried Bren gun and Boyes AT rifle.

    Motorcycle 1
    intelligence serjeant

    Motorcycle 2
    orderly

    Motorcycle 3
    orderly

    Motorcycle 4
    provost serjeant

    Motorcycle 5
    regimental policeman

    Motorcycle 6
    regimental policeman

    Headquarters Company
    The Headquarters Company provided administrative and supply support for the battalion. It was also responsible for the administration of the signals platoon and scout platoons although these operated independently of the company.

    Company Headquarters
    A small headquarters of six men.

    Captain
    Company Serjeant Major
    company quartermaster serjeant
    clerk
    driver IC
    orderly

    8cwt truck
    Captain, Company Serjeant Major, company quartermaster serjeant, clerk, driver IC

    Motorcycle
    orderly

    Administrative and transport platoon.
    Platoon headquarters


    Transport Officer
    Quartermaster
    Regimental Quartermaster Serjeant
    transport serjeant
    batman
    clerk
    driver mechanic
    driver
    armourer RAOC

    8cwt truck 1
    Quartermaster, Regimental Quartermaster Serjeant, clerk, driver mechanic

    8cwt truck 2
    Transport Officer, batman (for RSM), armourer RAOC, driver IC

    Motorcycle
    transport serjeant


    Medical section
    Medical Officer RAMC
    medical officer’s orderly
    batman
    2 X driver IC
    corporal stretcher bearer
    8 X stretcher bearer

    15cwt truck GS 1
    Medical Officer, batman, medical orderly, 3 X stretcher bearer, driver IC

    15cwt truck GS 2
    corporal stretcher bearer, 5 X stretcher bearer, driver IC
    Carries medical stores

    15cwt truck GS 3
    corporal stretcher bearer, 5 X stretcher bearer, driver IC
    Carries medical stores


    Administration and transport section

    15cwt truck 4
    sanitary dutyman, driver IC
    Carries reserve petrol

    15cwt water truck
    water dutyman, driver IC

    lorry 30cwt 6 X 4 GS 1
    motor mechanic, technical storeman, storeman, corporal driver IC
    Carries QM stores and baggage

    lorry 30cwt 6 X 4 GS 2
    motor mechanic, technical storeman, MT storeman, fitter MV RAOC,driver IC
    Carries MT stores and tools

    lorry 30cwt 6 X 4 GS 3
    2 X equipment repairers, blacksmith, bricklayer, mason, 2 X carpenter, driver IC
    Carries pioneer stores

    lorry 30cwt 6 X 4 GS 4
    postman, 2 X rifleman, 6 X batman, driver IC
    Carries a Bren lmg and an anti tank rifle

    lorry 30cwt 6 X 4 GS 5
    2 X batman, driver mechanic, officers mess cook, officers mess servant,

    lorry 30cwt 6 X 4 GS 6
    serjeant cook, butcher, 3 X cook, driver IC
    Caries cooking gear

    lorry 30cwt 6 X 4 GS 7
    sanitary dutyman, driver IC
    Carries reserve ammunition

    lorry 30cwt 6 X 4 GS 8
    pioneer serjeant, driver IC
    Carries blankets and anti gas reserves

    lorry 30cwt 6 X 4 GS 9
    2 X sanitary dutyman, driver IC
    Carries blankets and anti gas reserves


    Signal platoon.

    Subaltern, Signals Officer
    Signal serjeant
    corporal
    batman
    6 X driver operator
    3 X driver
    5 X motorcycle orderly
    9 X signaller

    8cwt truck 1
    Signal Officer, batman, driver operator, signaller
    Carried Wireless set No11.
    This vehicle acted as the Signal Officers vehicle and as Rear Link to the headquarters of division or whichever formation the battalion was reporting to. The vehicle was normally at Battalion headquarters.

    8cwt truck 2
    serjeant, driver operator, signaller, driver IC
    Carried Wireless set No 11
    This vehicle acted as Forward Link to companies. The vehicle was normally at battalion headquarters.

    8cwt truck 3
    driver operator, signaller
    Carried Wireless set No11.
    This vehicle was spare and could be deployed as required. When deployed to a forward platoon the platoon commander could use it as a command vehicle.

    8cwt truck 4
    driver operator, signaller
    Carried Wireless set No11
    This vehicle was spare and could be deployed as required. When deployed to a forward platoon the platoon commander could use it as a command vehicle.

    15cwt truck 1
    corporal driver operator, 3 X signaller, driver IC
    Carried hand cable layer and cable reels.

    15cwt truck 2
    driver operator, 3 X signaller, driver IC
    Carried signal stores

    Motorcycle 1
    orderly

    Motorcycle 2
    orderly

    Motorcycle 3
    orderly

    Motorcycle 4
    orderly

    Motorcycle 5
    orderly

    Motorcycle orderlies were for carrying messages etc.

    Cable would normally be laid only within the headquarters area, linking the tactical headquarters with the rear headquarters, or to flanking formations. Cable would not normally be suitable for forward communication.

    The Motorcycle Battalion had sixteen wireless sets on the establishment. This was a large number for the day. An infantry battalion did not have any. Apart from the four sets in the signal platoon there were four sets in each company. Note that this allotment does not allow a wireless set per motorcycle platoon and the scout platoons have none.

    There were two scout platoons each organised identically.
    Each:
    Subaltern
    3 X serjeant
    4 X corporal
    12 X driver IC
    batman
    3 X private

    Scout Platoon
    Headquarters
    Scout car
    Subaltern, driver IC

    Scout car
    corporal, driver IC

    15cwt GS truck
    corporal, batman

    3 X Section. Each:
    Scout car
    serjeant, driver IC

    Scout car
    corporal, driver mechanic

    Scout car
    private, driver mechanic



    3 X Motorcycle Company

    There were three motorcycle companies, lettered X, Y and Z to distinguish them from the companies of normal infantry battalions with whom they may be working.

    Company Headquarters
    Major
    Captain
    Company Serjeant Major
    company quartermaster serjeant
    corporal
    clerk
    2 X driver IC
    3 X driver operator
    5 X signaller
    4 X orderly
    4 X mechanic
    6 X private
    4 X cook

    8cwt truck
    Major, Company Serjeant Major, clerk, driver IC

    8cwt wireless truck
    Captain, 2 X signaller, driver IC
    Carried Wireless set No11.
    This vehicle was for Rear Link to battalion headquarters.

    8cwt wireless truck
    driver operator, signaller
    Carried Wireless set No11.
    This vehicle was for Forward Link to platoons.

    8cwt wireless truck
    driver operator, signaller
    Carried Wireless set No11.
    This vehicle was for deployment to a platoon as required. It would then be used as a command vehicle and would accommodate the platoon subaltern or serjeant.

    8cwt wireless truck
    driver operator, signaller
    Carried Wireless set No11.
    This vehicle was for deployment to a platoon as required. It would then be used as a command vehicle and would accommodate the platoon subaltern or serjeant.

    Motorcycle
    orderly

    Motorcycle
    orderly

    Motorcycle
    orderly

    Motorcycle
    orderly

    The motorcycle orderlies are for carrying messages etc. They may be detached to platoons.

    15cwt truck
    motor mechanic, technical storeman, driver IC,

    15cwt truck
    company quartermaster serjeant, storeman, 2 X batman, driver IC

    15cwt truck
    corporal, rifleman, driver IC
    This vehicle was fitted with an AA Motley mount.

    30cwt 6 X 4 lorry
    3 X cook, driver IC


    3 X Motorcycle Platoon each:

    Headquarters
    Motor Cycle Combination
    Subaltern, batman

    Motor Cycle Combination
    serjeant, driver IC

    15cwt truck
    private, driver IC

    Section
    Motor Cycle Combination
    corporal, 2 X private

    Motor Cycle Combination
    3 X private

    Motor Cycle Combination
    2 X private
    This vehicle carries a Bren gun

    Section
    Motor Cycle Combination
    corporal, 2 X private

    Motor Cycle Combination
    3 X private

    Motor Cycle Combination
    2 X private
    This vehicle carries a Bren gun

    Section
    Motor Cycle Combination
    corporal, 2 X private

    Motor Cycle Combination
    3 X private

    Motor Cycle Combination
    2 X private
    This vehicle carries a Bren gun

    Note:
    3 platoon had a WOIII instead of a Subaltern so there were differences in the establishment.

    Platoons 1 & 2
    Subaltern
    Serjeant
    3 X corporal
    batman
    2 X orderly
    2 X driver
    22 X private

    Platoon 3
    WOIII
    Serjeant
    3 X corporal
    2 X orderly
    3 X driver
    22 X private

    In France the WOIII may have been replaced by a Subaltern in which case all three platoons would be identical.

    Wireless sets
    The Battalion had a total of sixteen wireless sets. This was a high number for the day but not over generous for a reconnaissance unit operating in advance of a division and being widely spread out.

    The allocation of sets was laid down as follows

    Battalion Headquarters
    Wireless set 1 Rear Link to Division although one would normally expect that this would be the responsibility of the Royal Signals.
    Wireless set 2 Forward Link to all companies
    Wireless set 3 Spare
    Wireless set 4 Spare

    Each Company
    Wireless set 1 Rear Link to Battalion
    Wireless set 2 Forward Link to Platoons
    Wireless set 3 For allocation to platoons as required
    Wireless set 4 For allocation to platoons as required

    The allocation of wireless frequencies would normally be straightforward.
    Frequency 1 For rear link to Division. This would be a divisional frequency.
    Frequency 2 For communication from battalion to companies and to scout platoons if they were allocated a spare set.
    Frequency 3 For communication within companies. Normally companies would be sufficiently dispersed to allow all to use the one frequency.


    NORTON BIG 4
    The main vehicle of the motorcycle battalion was the Norton Big 4 motorcycle combination. The motorcycle itself was a rugged 633cc machine. The 4 of the title referred to 4 horse power. This is not related to bhp or brake horse power.

    The side car was designed with a driven wheel which took power from the rear wheel of the motorcycle. It was not permanently engaged but could be used for cross country use. Engaging the drive under road conditions made it difficult to steer and was expressly forbidden.

    The side car was of wood on a tubular metal chassis frame. The front was covered with a thin metal sheet. There was a wooden ammunition box at the rear and this had a fitting for a spare wheel. There were metal bars by which the crew could hold on over rough country or use to haul the machine over obstacles. There were clips for a Bren gun or rifle between the motorcycle and sidecar.

    A Crew of three could be carried, a driver, pillion passenger and side car passenger.


    DAIMLER SCOUT CAR
    The Daimler Scout Car was a very useful little vehicle. It was low, light and fast and yet carried the same armour protection as a cruiser tank, only 30mm on the front and 14mm on the sides. It had four wheel drive and the early models had four wheel steering. It also had a very high reverse speed. However reversing at speed and using four wheel steering was vary hazardous unless the driver was well trained.

    Daimler Scout Cars were in short supply. They were only just coming into service in late 1939 and most units who were fortunate enough to have any had to give them up to the armoured regiments.

    Mike.

    PS.
    Welcome to the forum.
     
  13. Dean Darvill

    Dean Darvill Active Member

    Mike,

    Thank you for your reply. I had found an organisational chart for a motorised infantry battalion on another website but was having difficulty in understanding it, your post is far easier to understand.

    Many thanks
     
  14. Trux

    Trux 21 AG

    Dean,

    A snippet from the topic I am working on at the moment, the Base and Line of Communication organisation that supported the BEF. This includes the organisation of the movement of units to France.

    4 Royal Northumberland Fusiliers (motorcycle) from Alderminster.
    7 Officers, 272 other ranks, 191 vehicles and 44 motorcycles. Road Party sailing 19 January.
    23 Officers and 344 other ranks. Rail Party sailing 22 January.
    Vehicles include 99 motorcycle combinations.

    The road party including vehicles and their crews usually sail three days before the main rail party. This is so that the vehicles an be unloaded in France and ready to join up with the rail party. The road party must be at the docks two days before the sailing date to allow time for loading.

    Vehicles are carried in cargo ships, each capable of carrying 180 vehicles. This varies slightly with the size of the ship and the size of the vehicles. Personnel are carried in cross channel ferries. These were served at both sides of the Channel by good rail connections and good passenger debarkation facilities.

    4 Royal Northumberland Fusiliers are shown as travelling from Alderminster for embarkation. This is usually a temporary assembly point.

    In January the weather was particularly bad so that troops had a difficult Channel crossing and a very wet and cold journey to Assembly and Concentration Points in France.

    Mike.
     
  15. Dean Darvill

    Dean Darvill Active Member

    Hi Mike,

    Thanks for this information, I think this tally's up with the battalion war diary. RC5774140-a801f765-73fb-434f-a05e-e2ffb65f4e89_5774140_WO_167_800_006.jpg RC5774140-a801f765-73fb-434f-a05e-e2ffb65f4e89_5774140_WO_167_800_007.jpg
     
  16. Trux

    Trux 21 AG

    It is nice when sources agree. I have learned two things. I did not know they sailed on Ulster Prince, an Irish Sea ferry rather than a Channel ferry. I have a list of ships and a list of units but I am having difficulty matching them. Every little helps. I guessed they went to Cherbourg but some sailings went to St Malo. My tables show all sailings and I know where they sailed from but the destination is seldom given.

    Mike
     
  17. Rich Payne

    Rich Payne Rivet Counter Patron 1940 Obsessive

    The Pathé propaganda film of 4 RNF in March 1940 is quite well-known but remains good fun...

    Forward The Light Brigade

    Motorcycling 18.4.1940 (2).jpg

    The chap waving his cap was the mayor of Le Crocq. I promoted myself to mayor for a day...

    3b.jpg

    As Mike Trux mentioned, the sidecar wheel drive Big 4 which was based on the pre-war 'Trials' Norton was surprisingly competent off-road...and I might add is great fun too.

    Zandpadentoertocht.jpg
     
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  18. Dean Darvill

    Dean Darvill Active Member

    Rich, thank you for your post.
    I wonder if the driver of the second motor cycle could be my grand father ? They look similar but it could just be that they both have thin moustaches.
     
  19. Rich Payne

    Rich Payne Rivet Counter Patron 1940 Obsessive

    I don't think that this chap has got quite the Ronald Coleman moustache that your grandfather did.

    Le Crocq Big size - For desktop (3).jpg
     
  20. Dean Darvill

    Dean Darvill Active Member

    Hi Rich,
    Thanks for posting. This picture is alot clearer, definitely not grandad.
     

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