P/O Geoffery B Knight 190953 RAFVR

Hello all,

Can anybody help me ?

I'm trying to find out about the career of P/O Geoffrey Benjamin Knight 190953, I'm aware he served with 37 Squadron and died on the 3rd April 1945, and is buried in Malta.

Many thanks
James

 

Can't find anything yet, but 37 Squadron flew Wellingtons.
I've got 8 killed on 3rd April, but Hogben is buried in Bari War Cemetery, these 7 are Malta Memorial.
BRADBURN HK 2210368 37 SQDN 03/04/1945 ROYAL AIR FORCE VOLUNTEER RESERVE
HARRIS J 175522 37 SQDN 03/04/1945 ROYAL AIR FORCE VOLUNTEER RESERVE
HORTON DW 1600215 37 SQDN 03/04/1945 ROYAL AIR FORCE VOLUNTEER RESERVE
HUNTER W 651127 37 SQDN 03/04/1945 ROYAL AIR FORCE
JARRATT CR 1165202 37 SQDN 03/04/1945 ROYAL AIR FORCE VOLUNTEER RESERVE
KNIGHT GB 190953 37 SQDN 03/04/1945 ROYAL AIR FORCE VOLUNTEER RESERVE
RILEY G 650259 37 SQDN 03/04/1945 ROYAL AIR FORCE
7 (or 8) would be very cramped in a Wellington, don't know the story here, too few for a collision, too many (?) for one....

 

Hello James

Service records would assist I know it is a cost.


KNIGHT, GEOFFREY BENJAMIN

Rank:

Pilot Officer

Service No:

190953

Date of Death:

03/04/1945

Age:

27

Regiment/Service:

Royal Air Force Volunteer Reserve



37 Sqdn.

Panel Reference

Panel 18, Column 1.

Memorial

MALTA MEMORIAL

Additional Information:
Son of Fred George Knight, and stepson of Nancy Elizabeth Knight, of Woodford Green, Essex.

 

James,

The Squadron was based in Egypt, North Africa, as quoted on this link.

http://www.radfanhunters.co.uk/37%20squadron.htm

After a further year of night-bombing operations over Germany, 37 Squadron moved to Egypt in November 1940 in support of allied operations in that region and stayed there for the remainder of the war.

Regards
Tom

 

Hi ,

thank you very much there is some information there that I didn't know, I have had a look at the links and they are very informative. its also interesting to see the casualties of that day from the squadron. Fingers crossed ill find out what happened, ill about sending for a service record.

best wishes
James

 

Re the above....37 Squadron, along with the Wellington X operated with the Liberator VI from October 1944, flying the Wellington X until October 1944. The Liberator until they were disbanded in March 1946. If this was an aircraft loss it would account for the large crew.

 

I found 2 possibilities at Ancestry. One born Mar 1918 in Northampton, Cambridge & the other born Sep 1918 Epsom, Surrey, Kent.

I found his Will entry attached from 1947. It gives his parents full address.

 

Thanks, Peter...
I did a search on CWGC for commemorations on 3 April 45 and came up with another possible crew member...
HOWE, ALFRED WILLIAM. Rank: Warrant Officer. Service No: 429244. Date of Death: 03/04/1945. Age: 33.
Regiment/Service: Royal Australian Air Force.
Panel Reference: Panel 19, Column 2. Memorial: MALTA MEMORIAL
Additional Information: Son of Richard and Anne Howe; husband of Elsie Howe, of Abermain, New South Wales, Australia.

I then tried to access any files in National Archives of Australia and came up with a bit more
HOWE, Alfred William - (Warrant Officer); Service Number - 429244
HOWE ALFRED WILLIAM : Service Number - 429244 : Date of birth - 05 Aug 1911 : Place of birth - ABERMAIN NSW : Place of enlistment - SYDNEY : Next of Kin - HOWE ELSIE

In addition to the file subject, the following servicemen are mentioned in this record:
ACKROYD T C – (Flight Sergeant); Service Number – 1578880
HOLLICK J D – (Sergeant); Service Number – 1392798
EDMONDSON R – (Flight Sergeant); Service Number – 1567150
CROLEY A J – (Flight Sergeant); Service Number – 1671274
AYRES F O G – (Flight Sergeant); Service Number – 1897726
LEWIS A – (Flight Sergeant); Service Number - 2217372
It also gave the Liberator Serial No. -
Serial Number: KK345. Aircraft Mk & Type Mk VI Liberator. Squadrons: 104. Details: Missing (Novska, Yugoslavia) 3.4.45. References: AB
... but shows as a 104 Sqdn aircraft....
I believe the personnel file for Alfred is in paper form, I think it needs a request for digitisation, does anyone know the procedure, time delay etc?
RAAF files often contain info about other crew members, if Alfred was part of this crew that may provide more information about Geoffrey...

EDIT: False trail..... KK345 was 104 Squadron with Howe aboard (the other Names may well be the other crew members)
Following that serial gave the following info on Yugoslavian air crashes www.mycity-military.com/uploads2/132517_797984893_yucrashes.xls‎

Well done that man, lot of info there).
Then to Joe Baugher site for further details...
Construction Number: 44426 to RAF as Liberator B.VI KK345. MIA on mission to Novska, Yugoslavia Apr 3, 1945.
Liberator B.VI KL361 No 37 Sqn Yugoslavia Mission to Novska, NFD
Construction Number 44473 to RAF as Liberator B.VI KL361. MIA on missing to Novska, Yugoslavia Apr 3, 1945.

So, there were two Liberators, tasked with resupplying the guerillas in Yugoslavia that both failed to return from a supply drop to the same location. If they set out from the same base, at about the same time, presumably at night, the possibility is that they collided somewhere over the sea, with no trace found so far.

I hope some of this info might help find more details!

 

Ordinarily, I'd agree with that statement but on the very same day as P/O Knight and crew were killed we have a 76 OTU Wellington, crew of nine, crashing with all hands lost.

http://www.rafcommands.com/forum/showthread.php?10727-Bedfordshires-Unaccounted-Aircrew/page2

But as far as P/O Knight and crew goes, they were aboard a Liberator, not a Wellington.

From the No. 37 Squadron ORB. Target was the Novska Marshaling yards.

 

Liberator VI KL361 P/37 Squadron

ex 44-44473

Delivered Dorval 16 January 1945
The aircraft had SNAKE markings but was noted as diverted to MAAF (Mediterranean Allied Air Force)
Arrived Maison Blanche 24 January 1945
To 37 Squadron 'P'
Failed to return from a raid on railway marshalling yards at Novska 4 April 1945
Struck Off Charge 26 April 1945

 

KL361 was one of eight Liberators detailed for the Novska Marshaling yards. Other seven Liberators carried 2x1000 GP, 8X500 GP and 8 packets of nickel each.

Weather is described as clear to Yugo-Slav coast, then patches of cirrus - on route. 4-6/10 S/cu (Strato cumulus) at 14,000ft and hazy in T/A. (target area)

Opposition - light inaccurate heavy flak and medium mainly inaccurate light flak from T/A.

Summary has P/O Knight and crew as "missing, believed fell into sea in flames at 2126 hrs"

Regards,

Dave

 

Clive,

That fits with this entry on the web.

Geoffrey Benjamin KNIGHT, 190953, Pilot Officer, Royal Air Force (V.R.), 37 Squadron, died 3rd April 1945, aged 27 years. Son of Frederick G. Knight, and stepson of Nancy E. Knight, of Woodford Green, Essex.

From Malta Family Hstory

http://website.lineone.net/~remosliema/

Regards
Tom

 

CWGC

has H.K.Bradburn
Sgt Bradburn KH F/E

regards
Clive

 

CWGC has it correctly:-
Birth, Baptism and Marriage records all have the same....
BRADBURN, HENRY KEITH. Rank: Sergeant. Service No: 2210368. Date of Death: 03/04/1945. Age: 39.
Regiment/Service: Royal Air Force Volunteer Reserve. 37 Sqdn.
Panel Reference: Panel 18, Column 2. Memorial: MALTA MEMORIAL
Additional Information: Son of Thomas Edward and Charlotte Ann Bradburn; husband of Evelyn Anne Bradburn, of Swinton, Lancashire.

Name: Henry Keith Bradburn. Date of Registration: Oct-Nov-Dec 1906. Registration District: Barton, Lancashire. Volume: 8c. Page: 605
Name: Henry Keith Bradburn. Birth Date: 10 Nov 1906. Baptism Date: 26 Dec 1906. Parish: Swinton, St Peter.
Father's Name: Thomas Edward Bradburn. Mother's Name: Charlotte Anna Bradburn. Reference Number: GB127.L174/1/2/5
Name: Henry K Bradburn. Spouse: Evelyn A Porter. Date of Registration: Oct-Nov-Dec 1935.
Registration District: Barton, Lancashire. Volume: 8c. Page: 1188.

... but none of this is helping OP with finding out the wartime service for Geoffrey!

Does his 190953 Service Number give any clues as to likely enlistment date etc?
This thread on PPRuNe gives a lot of information about the various aspects of training, selection and operations for bomber pilots, but don't think any Liberator experience on there! http://www.pprune.org/military-aircrew/329990-gaining-r-f-pilots-brevet-ww11.html
Careful!! There's 5 years and 200 pages packed with info there!

 

Hi Clive,

You're absolutely right and I knew that before I posted. But my history teacher would be rolling over in her grave if I did not transcribe verbatim from source documents.

See attached extract from No. 37 Squadron ORB.

Regards,

Dave

 

I disagree.

The OP now knows that his subject was a pilot. He knows the names of his crew and their trades. He knows that they were flying Liberators, not Wellingtons.

He knows the name of the target, the number of aircraft involved in the raid and the munitions they carried. The partisan supply drop scenario is a red herring (where did you get that from?) The only thing those Liberators dropped were 2x1000lb GPTD, 8 x 500lb GPTD and some paper letting the enemy know it would happen again. The ORB is pretty clear on what the duty and munitions were and even gives a time of crash into the sea.

I'd say he knows quite a bit, including even the weather conditions on the night his subject and crew lost their lives..The portion about his training etc won't be found in any ORB or by any amount of googling and as Clive points out service records are required and they do cost.

To the OP, if you PM me your email address I will send you the pages from the ORB where the Knight crew appears. I only have March- December 1945 which I bought after seeing this story on another site. Peter Clare made a post about it here:

http://ww2talk.com/forums/topic/7219-bombs-gone/

Essentially, a 37 Squadron Liberator had some some ordnance dropped on it from another Liberator overhead while on its bombing run. Although severely damaged the aircraft made it home intact. The photographs are all over the net if you look up "37 Squadron and Monfalcone". The rear gunner of the damaged kite, Sgt KH Westrope, wrote a book "A Rear Gunners Tale". Well worth a read as his description of the moment of impact is quite something.

The Knight crew does appear in the ORB in March as well.

Regards,

Dave

 

Hello to all that have left messages,

What a overwhelming response, the forum at it's best.

It is great to find out the names of the other members of the crew and some detailed information about them. I've looked at the photographs of the raids and some of the stories from it, moving and emotional and so near the end of the war.

Wonder if any pictures of KL361 survive ? I am passing on the great information that you have all produced to my friend Andrews grandmother, whom this search is for. P/O Knight was a good friend of hers and she found some old bits of his, and wanted to find out more. And we have.

Thanks for some of the ORB exerts to, I assume the bodies of the crew were not recovered?

Best wishes
James

 

Hi James,

Owing to a generous forum member I now have February 1945's ORB as well as appendices. I am hoping said member will take a bow for their gesture but will respect their anonymity. Thank you, mate.

From Page 196 of the Appendices P/O Knight is shown as posted in to the Squadron on 25 February 1944 Given he was on ops on 8 February this has to be an error.

Going further through the Appendices Navigator Warrant Officer Jarratt and B/A F/Sgt Horton are posted in 24 November 1944. WAG F/Sgt Hogben, 4 November 1944. A/G's Sgts Hunter and Riley, also 24 November 1944. A/G F/O Harris on 23 September 1944 and F/E Sgt Bradburn on 6 February, 1945.

I've gone through the ORB and these are the operations the Knight crew took part in. Numbers at end of each entry are takeoff and landing times.

* Operation "Flotsam" was a series of daylight resupply drops to Yugoslavian partisans. For a firsthand account of one, as well as all things 37 Sqn I'd have a read here: http://natureonline.com/37/contents.html Your mate's gran would probably enjoy reading the adventure of W/O James J. MacIsaac, RCAF.

The crew was halfway through their tour of operations. Crewlist as given in Post 9 is identical for all ops except on 8 February where Sgt RJ Grant substituted for Sgt Bradburn and P/O KH Johnson went along as 2nd Pilot. On the 1 March op to Arsa, F/Lt JD Anderson went along as 2nd W/Op.

Note that serial number KK361 on the 12 March Padua op is strangely similar to KL361, one of their regular machines. This suggests a typo, which it isn't. Peter Clare can quote chapter and verse on any RAF Liberator so will be able to tell you that both were on strength at the same time.

F/Sgt Hogben is buried at Bari War Cemetery so his remains were found. From where he drifted to where he was found I do not know. That the other seven airmen are on the Malta Memorial indicates they have no known grave.

Many thanks for your PM. I'll put all the source documents together and email them to you today.

Regards,

Dave

 

Intriguing that as per Post #2, Hogben does turn out to be part of the crew.
HOGBEN, RONALD GEORGE. Rank: Flight Sergeant. Trade: W.Op./Air Gnr. Service No: 1391913. Date of Death: 03/04/1945. Age: 20.
Regiment/Service: Royal Air Force Volunteer Reserve. 37 Sqdn.
Grave Reference: XVI. E. 4. Cemetery: BARI WAR CEMETERY
Additional Information: Son of Ronald George Henry Hogben and of Constance Hogben (nee Young), of Great Wyrley, Staffordshire.

Perhaps other crew members may actually be buried there, and might be worth the OP asking if the CWGC have any further details relating to the circumstances around the burial place(s) or recovery of Flt Sgt Hogben's body.

 

Liberator VI.KK361 was indeed allocated to 37 Squadron as its movement history shows.....

ex 44-4442
Delivered Dorval 28 December 1944
To the Middle East
Arrived Maison Blanche 16 January 1945
To 37 Squadron (No precise dates)
To 40 Squadron
Overshot abandoned on take-off at Foggia Main 29 March 1945 and struck crashed Wellington
Struck Off Charge 3 May 1945.