2nd Northamptonshire Yeomanry EPSOM

Discussion in 'NW Europe' started by m kenny, Sep 27, 2019.

  1. m kenny

    m kenny Senior Member

    Are there any obscure accounts of the Unit and its dash to the ODON during EPSOM? I have all the 11th AD books and EPSOM accounts but they are not very good for this Unit. The book Sixty Four Days Of A Normandy Summer simply states 7 Cromwells were lost before the Unit was withdrawn and the IWM has films

    A70 90-9
    TROOP MOVEMENTS IN THE HEAT AND DUST OF NORMANDY [Allocated Title]

    and A70 90-10

    INFANTRY AND ARMOURED UNITS MOVE UP TO THE FRONT IN THE ODON VALLEY [Allocated Title]

    that show 3 Cromwell wrecks (you got to look very closely to spot the 3rd Cromwell) and I am fairly confident the German Wochenshau 725 July 26 has another 2 of their Cromwells at 6m 44s



    I understand there is a problem with the War Diary and parts are missing
     
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  2. Tom OBrien

    Tom OBrien Senior Member

    Michael,

    I've got the missing file of 2 NY and several of the numbers of Cromwells contained are very close to T187760. No smoking gun, but I would assume likely. For example, there is an 'A' Sqn Cromwell (T187703) recorded lost on 29 June at 9064 7F1 and from which all the crew were either killed or captured. Also Cromwell (T187727) lost on same date in same place and also of 'A' Sqn.

    It looks like these tanks were lost on the withdrawal from GRANVILLE, 9264. Survivors report it being dark, surrounded by enemy infantry and one of the survivors reports being in a Cromwell which ran into a 'burning Panther tank'.

    I hope that helps - I'll look more over the weekend.

    Regards

    Tom
     
  3. m kenny

    m kenny Senior Member

    I have been trying to locate the German newsreel footage for nearly 15 years and had already settled on the 2 rail-crossings. Unfortunately the bed of the railway in now a motorway with all buildings obliterated so no chance of a 'Then & Now'.

    Grainville crossings  .jpg

    Screenshot_257.jpg Screenshot_258.jpg
     
    Last edited: Sep 27, 2019
  4. Tom OBrien

    Tom OBrien Senior Member

    Michael,

    I don't know if this Grave Concentration Report Form offers any clues. The last entry is a man from one of the 2nd Northants Yeomanry tanks (T187703) lost in the action (according to the missing file):

    Grave Concentration Report.JPG

    The regimental history has a short account of the action, but no clue as to its location.

    Regards

    Tom
     
  5. m kenny

    m kenny Senior Member

    As the rail crossing is clear in the German newsreel then it must be a railway line and given the way 2 NY were heading one of two crossings. I have seen two accounts (probably just the one source repeated) that claim 3 Troop were 'wiped out' before the got to the railway line but as one of the Cromwells at the crossing has a '3' inside the triangle marking that must be wrong.
    The area of the burial is the red square, Crossings red circles.
    Screenshot_1j81j.jpg
     
  6. Tom OBrien

    Tom OBrien Senior Member

    Hi Michael,

    The account from the regimental history might help:

    Regt History p.116.JPG Regt History p.117.JPG

    looking at the map from the regimental history - and assuming that the "C" Squadron route was on the left facing towards the bottom of the map - I would suggest that it is most likely the eastern railway crossing of the two. The films fit the accounts in the regt history and missing file quite well I think, suggesting that at least some of the tanks went over the railway and then tried to get back to the railway crossing.

    Regt History - Epsom map.JPG

    Regards

    Tom
     
  7. m kenny

    m kenny Senior Member

    All the available images.

    Wochenshau  725 July 26 1944 Cromwells crossing -vert.jpg Cromwell  Crossing j b.jpg Cromwell Crossing  Woch 725 (11.jpg Cromwell level crossing, Wochenshau  725 July 26-vert.jpg
     
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  8. Tom OBrien

    Tom OBrien Senior Member

    Michael,

    T187698 was definitely "A" Sqn, 2nd Northamptonshire Yeomanry:

    T187698.JPG

    Hopefully that will help.

    Regards

    Tom
     
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  9. m kenny

    m kenny Senior Member

    Help? It bloody well solves it!
     
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  10. m kenny

    m kenny Senior Member

    Over the road and behind this Cromwell is a section of Panther track.

    Screenshot_239.jpg
    Screenshot_241_stitch.tifdrfwerFasf.jpg
     
    Last edited: Sep 30, 2019
  11. m kenny

    m kenny Senior Member

    The dates seem a bit out of kilter. The dash for the Odon was on 26th-27th and the MIA report says 29-30th,
     
  12. Tom OBrien

    Tom OBrien Senior Member

    Hi Michael,

    According to Regt history the ‘dash for Odon bridges’ on 26/27 Jun was ‘A’ Sqn only and they only lost 2 tanks. Then a pause and another attack on 29/30 as per the missing file. Would you like me to post up a couple more pages that should clarify the sequence?
     
  13. m kenny

    m kenny Senior Member

    That might help. The II/Pz Rgt 12 (HJ/12th SS) ) 'War Diary' account for July 30th did not survive the war
     
  14. Tom OBrien

    Tom OBrien Senior Member

    Hi Michael,

    It's only a short account, but it should clarify the order of events and hopefully help further.

    Regt History - p.114 - 115.JPG

    Regt History - p.116.JPG

    Regt History - p.117.JPG

    Regards

    Tom
     

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