2nd Bn Royal Fusiliers grandparent research

Discussion in '1940' started by MikeE, Jul 26, 2015.

  1. MikeE

    MikeE Member

    Hi there

    I'm looking for advice from any Royal Fusilier experts as I am investigating my own grandfathers time in the regiment. I originally posted this in another section of this forum but was advised to post here too so here goes..

    My grandad served in the regiment for more than 20 years but in particular I am interested in where he was as part of the BEF in 1940. He was called Henry 'Dick' Balmer and though he survived the war and lived until the early sixties that was some time before I was born and so I never knew him. I am interested in finding out more so that I can tell my children about it when they start learning more about history.

    I know that he was a company sergeant major in 'W' company as part of the 2nd Battalion and that he was injured sometime in Dunkirk with a shrapnel would to the head which took him some time to recover from. I'd be interested to get advice on the best way to find out about exactly where he was during this period. Wondered also if there were any ex-fusiliers or more likely relatives of other ex-fusiliers who may have served with him.

    I will try to fusiliers museum at the Tower of London and my aunts have some info but looking for as many other sources as possible. Many thanks to any who can help in advance.

    Mike
     
  2. Rich Payne

    Rich Payne Rivet Counter Patron 1940 Obsessive

    I believe that Drew (Andy) on the 1940 forum will be able to help with a copy of this battalion's diary if you're not near enough to Kew to visit yourself (although if you're interested in family and military history, it's a fascinating place to visit).

    This is the diary that you need :-

    http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/results/r/?_q=WO167%2F739
     
  3. Tricky Dicky

    Tricky Dicky Don'tre member

  4. idler

    idler GeneralList

    Post-1940 information, but I suspect that this thread will be the dominant one once Andy gets started...


    'This time' being 1 October 1943, so he was RSM during the Tunisian campaign. The quote is from The 2nd Battalion Royal Fusiliers (City of London Regiment) in North Africa, Italy & Greece March 1943 - May 1945 (but not the BEF).

    Here are a couple of London Gazette entries relating to his commission (and his new number):
    https://www.thegazette.co.uk/London/issue/36621/supplement/3446
    https://www.thegazette.co.uk/London/issue/37039/supplement/2069
     
  5. Drew5233

    Drew5233 #FuturePilot 1940 Obsessive

    Hi

    A date of the wounding would be a great help. I could narrow down to the actual fighting where he was wounded with a date. The only place I know you'll find this info should be in his service records. I'm looking through the diary now as I type.......
     
  6. MikeE

    MikeE Member

    Thanks- I knew from his obituary he was given an emergency commission. He joined the army in 1928 so had been a regular for some time before the war. His time in Italy is definitely interesting too- at some point he was awarded an MBE which I would obviously like to find out more about.
     
  7. MikeE

    MikeE Member

    My aunt is seeking his service records at the moment so can provide this date in due course. She still has the piece of shrapnel in question.. They must have given it too him as a souvenir!
    Thanks for your efforts!
     
  8. Drew5233

    Drew5233 #FuturePilot 1940 Obsessive

    There's some bits and pieces about W Company during May but all the positions are noted as Field (In the Field). However it does appear to be quite accurate at recording the deaths of Officers so if they are buried in local communal graves that's probably the biggest clue you'll get regarding where they were fighting. I knew they came to the beaches via Nieuwpoort but interestingly the diary mentions numerous Blockhouses being used SW of Nieuwpoort, I suspect some of these may well be Blockhouses near where I stayed in Oostduinkerke this year. I had just assumed they were used in WW1 and damaged in the same war.

    For starters I can tell you the Battalion arrived at Cherbourg at 7am on 6th October from Aldershot. As Rich rightly said, most if not all of the Battalion were lifted off the beaches, most likely De Panne, possibly some from Bray Dunes on the 1st June arriving at ports along the south coast inc Dover.
     
  9. idler

    idler GeneralList

    He must have been with a different battalion in Italy, as he's not listed with 2nd Bn after going for his commission. There may well be a citation for his MBE that should confirm who he was with and what he did.
     
  10. Rich Payne

    Rich Payne Rivet Counter Patron 1940 Obsessive

    The rank of Lieutenant or Captain Quartermaster was traditionally filled by someone promoted from the ranks, frequently an ex-RSM. The duties were linked. The MBE is an award that was also frequently given to these men for service over a period rather than a specific event.

    My Grandfather was also a pre-war regular who became RSM after the 1940 losses in France and the granting of a Quartermaster commission to the the previous RSM. He too was awarded the MBE in Italy. I was able to obtain a copy from the National Archive.

    Your Grandfather's MBE recommendation is available for download on the National Archive site at a cost of £3.30

    http://discovery.nationalarchives.gov.uk/details/r/D7380850

    Please share it if you obtain it :)

    edit :- I see the words 'cheerful' and 'untiring' on the recommendation which are fairly usual for this award. If the RSM and QM were not doing their job then the men were not being fed and supplied so their job was vital for the battalion.
     
  11. Drew5233

    Drew5233 #FuturePilot 1940 Obsessive

    Don't pay for the MBE. I'll dig it out for free unless someone beats me to it. I'm still on with the 1940 stuff at the mo-I've found him mentioned in a 2nd Battalion RRF book ;)

    Edit: The only mention I could see so far is in a book published in 1941 called A Short History of the 2nd Battalion, Royal Fusiliers During the First Year of the War. It's the battalions Orbat and confirms he was the CSM for W Company
     
  12. idler

    idler GeneralList

  13. Drew5233

    Drew5233 #FuturePilot 1940 Obsessive

    [​IMG]
     
    RosyRedd likes this.
  14. Rich Payne

    Rich Payne Rivet Counter Patron 1940 Obsessive

    No. 1 Corps Reinforcement Unit.

    Did NA not copy the reverse with the countersignatures ?
     
  15. Drew5233

    Drew5233 #FuturePilot 1940 Obsessive

    Nope, just the one page for this one.
     
  16. MikeE

    MikeE Member

    Wow- that's great to see! Thanks
    It sounds like a trip to the national archives would be useful and also very interesting. He was also in Korea in the Korean War so there is a lot to find out about.
     
  17. MikeE

    MikeE Member

    As it happens my aunt emailed me today with some items i had not seen before. I attach a couple for general interest. One is the structure of his platoon in 1938 and the other a photo of him (on the right, giving salute) in front of Mansion House. My aunt also has the copy of the army form sent to my grandma informing her he had been admitted to hospital in Staines with a ''head wound'..and very little other narrative which must have been quite a shock for her. Still better than a telegram stating missing or killed in action of course...The date of the telegram was 1st june 1940 so he must have been evacuated at least a day before this. I look forward to a trip to Kew at some point and thanks to all who have been so helpful so far.
     

    Attached Files:

  18. Lotus7

    Lotus7 Well-Known Member

    Found this is it of any help guys. On ********. Com

    0506 WO 373/72 BALMER, HENRY LIEUTENANT 313091 ROYAL FUSILIERS ITALY MEMBER OF THE BRITISH EMPIRE 19 APRIL 1945 ITALY: 21 DEC 1944-19 APR 1945

    David
     
  19. lambretta

    lambretta Junior Member

    Mike. My Grandfather was in X platoon. He managed to get away from the beaches. Always A Fusilier is a good book to read with mention of Dunkirk. They took a lot of casualties. The history of their time in France is another good read. Gives a blow by blow account of the battles.

    Barrie Sears

     

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