2nd Airlanding Light Anti-Aircraft Battery R.A. (T.A.) in Normandy

Discussion in 'Airborne' started by Cfn Clive, May 6, 2012.

  1. Cfn Clive

    Cfn Clive Junior Member

    Hi All

    I am after information on the 2nd Airlanding Light Anti-Aircraft Battery R.A. (T.A.) in Normandy 1944. From the regimental diary on Go to It Gunners site Go To It Gunners - 2AL LAA Bty
    on the 17th May 1944 Three subalterns posted to this unit from the 53rd Air Landing Light Regt R.A. and attached for all purposes to this Battery’s S.S. detachment. The S.S. detachment, comprising 4 officers and 46 OR’s, leaves for marshalling area.
    From the same site unit history it states On the same day 1 officer and 46 Other ranks were detailed for specialised training in the use of enemy equipments.
    and On D-Day, 6th June 1944, the Battery provided a detachment in support of 6th Airborne Division. The Detachment remained with the Division throughout the campaign in Normandy, finally returning to the UK on 30th August 1944.
    A few questions are these the same officer and 46 men who had been trained on enemy equipment that went to Normandy, with the 3 officers from 53 Air Landing Regiment?
    Did they take the Airportable Bofors 40mm with them? I understand that the Airportable 20mm Polsten was not used by the airborne forces in action. For Market Garden the battery took 6 Bofors to Nijmagen.
    Were they air transported or did they arrive, like a large part of the 6th Airborne's artillery, by sea?
    Did they use enemy equipment, if so what? The 6th Armd Recce Regt used 20 mmFlacK 38 on a Sd10/4 to shoot down a couple of enemy aircraft.

    The only mention of this detachment on the Pegasus Archive site is that they provided addtional gunners for the Anti-Tank Batteries during the campaign.

    I realise these might remain unanswered questions.

    Cheers

    Clive
     
  2. Cee

    Cee Senior Member Patron

    Hi Clive,

    Your thinking makes sense to me as they are listed in the Orbat and your quote does say that particular detachment leaves for the marshalling area. Although it should be noted there may have been some kind of divisional exercise around that time.

    Here's another thread you may have already seen on the subject that's a bit confused, but does list men from the unit that died on June 6th which would suggest they were airlanded.

    2nd Airlanding LAA Battery 6th A/B Div

    I can't help you with the weapons used. Could you explain the "S.S." in S.S. detachment?
     
  3. wolly55

    wolly55 Junior Member

    Hi Clive ,

    My uncle was gunner Dennis Simmons 1807362 , he was part of the 2nd airlanding light anti aircraft battery.
    I was told many years ago that they went in by boat but after searching and coming across a missing persons report that was passed onto me , i can confirm with you that some did go in by glider , my uncle was on glider no125 which was hit by flak and exploded.
    I spoke to Gareth from Go to it gunners along time ago , and he told me about a list he had which gave the names of the people who were on each training exercise , the day they went to train in the use of using captured enemy artillery Dennis was on shooting and target practice somewhere else.
    I have been searching the web and records for information for about 6 years now and still there is lots of information missing.
    Dennis was attached to the 53rd wor yeo on d day which took off from Tarrant Rushton after the main lift that went in to take the bridges , but there is nothing on the main flight records for them taking off from there only the main lift.
    Sometimes i wonder if everything was so mixed up records were lost or he was put in at the last minute.
     
  4. Cfn Clive

    Cfn Clive Junior Member

    Hi Gee and Wolly

    Thanks for your input.

    Further to my post from the war diary of 3rd Airlanding Anti Tank Battery RA
    9th June 1944
    Place: Ranville

    0930 - Arrival of 4 B Tp 17 prs by sea. 12 B Tp personnel relieved in LONGUEVAL by detachment 2 Airldg LAA Bty.

    It looks like from very early on the detachment may not have been employed in their role as AA gunners. I cannot find any mention of them returning to their own command.

    As for S.S. detachment I have no idea. I was hoping someone would be able to answer this for me.

    Cheers

    Clive
     
  5. idler

    idler GeneralList

    SS is probably 'special service' (as used by the Commando brigade), in that it wasn't their normal job.
     
  6. Cfn Clive

    Cfn Clive Junior Member

    SS is probably 'special service' (as used by the Commando brigade), in that it wasn't their normal job.

    Hi Idler

    I was thinking on the same lines but that just opens up another question, what as speical about their service?

    Clive
     
  7. Cee

    Cee Senior Member Patron

    Clive,

    A couple of quotes from Go To It Gunners found here and here.

    "During this period he was one of a small Special Service Detachment of his Battery that served in Normandy and was attached to 3rd Airlanding Anti-Tank Battery R.A."

    "On D-Day, 6th June 1944, the Battery provided a detachment in support of 6th Airborne Division. The Detachment remained with the Division throughout the campaign in Normandy, finally returning to the UK on 30th August 1944. "

    In the 6th Airborne Div HQ WD under notes for D-Day + 1:

    "Det 2 Airldg LAA Bty (manning 2 captured 2 cm guns and assisting to man arty 6 prs)"

    I couldn't find much else concerning their activity in Normandy.

    I'm not sure about Normandy, but the Polsten gun was used as a ground weapon by the support troop for the 1st Airborne Reconnaissance Squadron at Arnhem.
     
  8. Drew5233

    Drew5233 #FuturePilot 1940 Obsessive

    You may find the answer or clues in the often overlooked unit diary appendices:

    WO 171/1018 2 LAA Air Landing Regiments and Batteries 1944 May, Aug-Dec.

    Looks like June and July is missing though.
     
  9. Drew5233

    Drew5233 #FuturePilot 1940 Obsessive

    I'd check the Home Forces one too as it seems to overlap:

    WO 166/14936 2 LAA Air Landing Regiments and Batteries 1944 Feb.-Aug.
     
  10. Cee

    Cee Senior Member Patron

    wolly55,

    See the first Air Movement Table under Appendix C in the WD of the 5th Brigade HQ. At the bottom are gliders chalk number 125 and 126 from Tarrant Rushton which were carrying FOOs for 3 Para Brigade. That group of gliders landed at LZ N at about 3:30 AM on D-Day.

    The Air Movement Table below that is for what you call the "main lift" consisting in this case of the coup de main gliders, pathfinders, advance parties and para battalions of the 5th Brigade. What's missing, of course, is the Air Movement Table for the 3rd Brigade.

    It's not much, but it does seem to confirm that glider 125 left Tarrant Rushton in the third wave.
     
  11. wolly55

    wolly55 Junior Member

    Thanks Cee for pointing that out , unfortunately glider chalk no 125 which my uncle was on was blown up and 126 crashed with the occupants being taken as pow.
    Im not sure how to link to another thread my if you type in a search Dennis Simmons ive attached the missing persons report that someone emailed me , also explains what they were going to do.

    thanks again
     
  12. Cee

    Cee Senior Member Patron

    wolly,

    Whoops, I meant of course that entire wave was intended to come in around that time. Unfortunately there were a number of gliders like your uncle's that didn't make it.

    And thanks I'll check your thread out which I'll link to here:

    2nd Airlanding LAA BTY Dennis Simmons 1807632
     
    wolly55 likes this.
  13. brithm

    brithm Senior Member

    Saw this on Pegasus archive,

    http://www.pegasusarchive.org/normandy/frames.htm

    I do have all of what the Royal Artillery Museum hold on the 2nd Light Anti Aircraft Battery except for the Arnhem bits and pieces. I don't know how much Duxford Archives have on the unit. I will try to load up what I have scanned today.
     
  14. brithm

    brithm Senior Member

    Hi

    I was unable to load up the bits and pieces I have on the 2nd LAA and 6th Anti Tank Bty but would be happy to email anyone the stuff I have.

    Send me an email and hopefully I will be able to forward you copies of what I have.

    brithm
     
    wolly55 likes this.
  15. wolly55

    wolly55 Junior Member

    Thanks for the information brithm , sent you a pm.
     
  16. Cfn Clive

    Cfn Clive Junior Member

    Clive,

    A couple of quotes from Go To It Gunners found here and here.

    "During this period he was one of a small Special Service Detachment of his Battery that served in Normandy and was attached to 3rd Airlanding Anti-Tank Battery R.A."

    "On D-Day, 6th June 1944, the Battery provided a detachment in support of 6th Airborne Division. The Detachment remained with the Division throughout the campaign in Normandy, finally returning to the UK on 30th August 1944. "

    In the 6th Airborne Div HQ WD under notes for D-Day + 1:

    "Det 2 Airldg LAA Bty (manning 2 captured 2 cm guns and assisting to man arty 6 prs)"

    I couldn't find much else concerning their activity in Normandy.

    I'm not sure about Normandy, but the Polsten gun was used as a ground weapon by the support troop for the 1st Airborne Reconnaissance Squadron at Arnhem.

    Thanks Gee

    From the information you have given and another entry in the same war diary for the same day would indicate that the men from 2 Air Landing LAA Bty were those trained in the use of enemy equipment. That is of great help for the project I am undertaking.

    I do drawings of soldiers and equipment for a war-games site Junior General Home Pageand have slowly been doing the various units of the 6th Airborne Division during the Normandy campaign and was interested if the airborne Bofors was used and if I need to draw it. The notes in the Trux pages of this forum relating to the airborne Polsten state it was not used, I have done a drawing of it so a wargamer can "change history" should he wish. Airborne Anti-Aircraft Platoonat the bottom of the page.

    I have been doing the Bofors and in my research I have been side tracked into drawing all the main variants of British Bofors guns. I now have to draw a British airborne crew for my 2cm FlaK 38. I will do a airborne Bofors with crew for those war-gamers who wish to do Operation Market Garden.

    Thanks to all that have contributed. I hope this thread has been helpful to Wooley. brithm I will be sending you a PM.


    If anyone is interested in my final drawings please let me know and I will post copies on here.
     
  17. Taylor94

    Taylor94 New Member

    Dear All,
    My great-grandfather was (1639052) Gunner Leonard 'Ted' Edwin Charles Lawrence who was in glider Chalk No 126, of the 2nd Airlanding LAA Battery on Operation Tonga. I have been doing a large amount of research into the events of 6 June 1944. Wally55 do you have any photos of other men or the gliders at Tarrant Rushton, from your uncle?
    What role did Dennis having in the 2nd Airldg LAA? Ted was a motorcycle despatch rider.
    Thanks in advance!
    Adam
     
    Ludo68000 likes this.
  18. Sheldrake

    Sheldrake All over the place....

    Part VII of the Report on the 6th Airborne Division states that the detachment of 2nd AA Light Regiment was deployed in support of 1st Special Services Brigade. It was trained to use enemy AA equipment to provide some AA defence for this commando brigade.

    No one knew how much of a threat the luftwaffe would pose. In the event these AA gunners were more use as Anti-tank gunners.
     

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