2721873 John Clayton MOORE, Royal Irish Fusiliers: Help needed with Dad's service records

Discussion in 'Service Records' started by Pete9401, Jul 25, 2013.

  1. Pete9401

    Pete9401 Member

    Hi, I am a new member trying to unravel my Dad's army service in WW2. Working through his service records it would appear that he enlisted in the Irish Guards in July 1940 but his medical at Caterham shows he was A1 (unfit role of Gds) and transferred to Royal Irish Regiment Fusiliers. He trained at Ballykinlar until May 1941 when he was posted to the Reconnaissance Corps No 1 Training Centre possibly in Scotland. In Jan 1942 he rejoined the 1st Bn RIRF at Thetford and eventually embarked for North Africa on 21/11/42 (probably from Liverpool). He was hospitalized between March and June 1943 then posted to No 6 I.S.S.U before rejoining the RIRF on 13/8/45.
    The gaps I am trying to fill relate to:-
    1. What he was doing with the Reconnaissance Corps?
    2. What and where was No 6 I.S.S.U(ME20) and (ME34)?
    3. Why and where he was hospitalized, I think he was admitted to 18 CCS then 72 & 94 General Hospitals and discharged from 9 CD.
    Dad died in 1986 but never really spoke about the war, I spent 30 years in the RAF and have had his medals for years, he had the Africa Star (1st Army Clasp), Italy Star, 39 - 45 Star and 39 - 45 medal.
    I have found the Irish Brigade website has transcripts of the 1st Bn RIRF War Diaries but don't know which company dad was in.
    I would appreciate any tips members can provide on where to look for further information.

    Many thanks

    Pete
     
  2. Tony56

    Tony56 Member Patron

    Pete, If you have looked at the Irish Brigade website then I guess that you have a good overview of your father's service. You might like to look at this link which mentions 6ISSU, presumably the SU stands for signals unit. You may get some more information by asking here.
    http://ww2talk.com/forums/topic/37841-1-special-force-in-italy/?p=460627

    The following site gives some information on WW2 hospitals:
    http://www.scarletfinders.co.uk/133.html

    Have you any more detail on his time with the Reconnaissance Corps?

    Although the Irish Brigade diaries are published I am not sure if the appendices to them are, these can give much more information and often mention individuals by name whereas the diaries rarely do.

    Happy hunting.
     
  3. Tony56

    Tony56 Member Patron

  4. bexley84

    bexley84 Well-Known Member

    For the 38 (Irish) Brigade bit, if your father travelled with the Faughs to Algeria in November 1942, no doubt he would have embarked with the battalion from Liverpool with their arrival in Algiers being delayed by a collision in the Straits of Gibraltar.

    For the period Dec 1942 to March 1943, you would have seen that 1 RIrF were initially positioned near to Goubbellat before moving south in January into the area north of Bou Arada (Grandstand Ridge) and in late February involved in some significant action west of the Goubellat to Bou Arada road at Stuka Ridge.

    As Tony says the appendices might throw up some more detail, although unlikely to name specific men by name - by the way, what was your father's name?

    A quite outstanding personal narrative of those months in the line for the Faughs is one written by Major John Coldwell Horsfall (later Lt-Col), who was OC D Coy, 1 RIrF during the winter/spring period of 1942/1943. It's titled "The Wild Geese Are Flighting".

    best
     
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  5. Recce_Mitch

    Recce_Mitch Very Senior Member

    Pete could you scan and post his records as as it would help in understanding them .

    Cheers
    Paul
     
  6. Pete9401

    Pete9401 Member

    Thanks to everyone for helping, my dad was John Clayton Moore b 08/07/1912. I will put dads records up in the near future but i have photo's of them for now. Wish I had asked him about his experiences!!

    Cheers

    Pete image.jpg image.jpg image.jpg image.jpg image.jpg image.jpg image.jpg image.jpg image.jpg
     
  7. bexley84

    bexley84 Well-Known Member

    Pete,

    I had a quick scan of "The Wild Geese..", and your father isn't mentioned (which is hardly surprising).

    His hospitalisation date in early March coincided with a "rest period" for the Faughs, after some pretty frantic weeks in the Stuka Ridge area. They continued patrolling in early March 1943 before being slung to the north of Oued Zarda for some mountain climbing in April.

    Lt-Col Murphy Palmer wrote your Dad's reference note - as he had been away from the Faughs for nearly three years, he couldn't really say too much, I suppose.

    best,
     
  8. Pete9401

    Pete9401 Member

    Richard,

    Thanks again, I have located a library copy of "The Wild Geese......." Which I have reserved and look forward to reading, is there any way of finding out which company my dad was in? I have one surviving postcard that dad sent home dated 06/04/43 in which he says "I am feeling a lot better now" so i assume he must have come down with something that put him in hospital!

    Regards

    Pete
     
  9. bexley84

    bexley84 Well-Known Member

    Pete,

    You might struggle given the fact that your father didn't ever give or leave you any clues on what company or/and what role he played in the Irish Fusiliers - did he serve in one of the four rifle companies or in HQ company, and within either grouping, what specific tasks did he undertake?

    John Horsfall's account is a very evocative story of the realities of the fighting for the Faughs in Tunisia, and although a D Company centric view, it will give you an extremely good idea of what the whole battalion and brigade faced on the Goubellat and Bou Arada plains.

    During the Dec 1942 to March 1943 period, around 60 Royal Irish Fusiliers died in Tunisia, and a multiple of this amount were wounded or captured, so of the 800 odd who came out to Algiers in December with your Dad, a significant proportion departed the battalion during this period. The roll of men from November 1942 that I've seen "only" goes down to Sgt level and does not cover the names of any fusiliers.

    I suppose the potential sources for further research might be:

    - Veterans accounts. I'm not certain how many of the men who served with 1 RIrF in Tunisia are still around (answer not many) . I've only recently heard of one Faugh alive from that era. No doubt they are more around, but you will find it "difficult" to locate them, and perhaps they wouldn't recall a specific name and face.

    - The National Archives. I've copied the day by day war diary entries and a few back up narratives from that Dec 1942 to March 1943 period, but given the fact that your father didn't die (thankfully), and wasn't awarded a DCM or an MM, even if you scanned the hundreds of pages, you're unlikely to find him.

    - Regimental Archives. You could consider contacting the Faughs' Museum people in Armagh, but I'm not entirely sure that they have a definitive log of men, who served with them. Horsfall's account is a de facto regimental history, albeit focussed on one rifle coy.

    - Your father's papers (if there are any).


    best
     
  10. bexley84

    bexley84 Well-Known Member

    Pete,

    Just one more for you...

    I was talking to a friend of my father's today and referred to ISSU 6. He then told me that he and his (later) wife both served at ISSU 6 in Algeria during 1943 and 1944 before he was sent off to Bari.

    Coincidentally this gentleman also served with the Irish Brigade (2 LIR) before being injured in March 1943 and then later being medically downgraded, and as a result left 2 LIR and was kicking his heels until he responded to an "advert" and thence reported to a strange location at Phillipeville.(now known as Skikda). He then found he would be employed as a cipher specialist at Massingham (ISSU 6)

    Strange how these linkages emerge...

    best
     
  11. Pete9401

    Pete9401 Member

    Richard,

    Remarkable, do you think your fathers friend would be willing to say what sort of tasks 6 ISSU did? By the way my Dad was always known as 'Jack' Moore rather than John and he was from Liverpool. I think dad may have been involved in packing and preparing containers for parachute drops, does this make sense?

    Regards

    Pete
     
  12. bexley84

    bexley84 Well-Known Member

    Pete,

    His particular task was on ciphers / coding.- and no doubt there were a range of activities at the Massingham site - he met his wife who was a signaller (under the FANY monicker) - if you google "Massingham", you'll find some links that might describe what was going on down there. "Preparing containers for parachute drops", in an SOE context would, of course, make total sense.

    You may wish to start another complementary thread titled "ISSU 6" or something like that as there are a few SOE specialists lurking around, who might help with further details if they notice the thread.

    My father's friend is nearly 95 - still drives and met me last week in central London. A rather remarkable man. I mentioned ME 20 and ME 34 to him and he suggested they probably referenced a "department code". i mentioned your Dad's name to him but it didn't ring a bell.

    Just to clarify one other thing, you say that your father was born in 1912, but there seemed some reference to him being 24 when he was demobbed. No doubt you are right.

    best
     
  13. Pete9401

    Pete9401 Member

    Richard,

    Thanks, I wiil take your advice and start a new thread or 6 ISSU, dad was definitely born on 08/07/12 so would have been 28 when he enlisted. I wondered where the 24 came from too. Thanks again for all your help.

    Regards

    Pete
     

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