Remember remember the fifth of November

Discussion in 'The Lounge Bar' started by CL1, Nov 5, 2014.

  1. ozzy16

    ozzy16 Well-Known Member

    guyf.jpg

    Graham.
     
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  2. bamboo43

    bamboo43 Very Senior Member

    I was thinking something similar myself.
     
  3. dbf

    dbf Moderatrix MOD

    Thanks, I forgot.
     
  4. KevinBattle

    KevinBattle Senior Member

    Guy Fawkes. He was born in Yorkshire in 1570 into a well-off Protestant family. After leaving school Fawkes entered the service of Anthony Browne, 1st Viscount Montagu, as a footman on his estate at Cowdray in West Sussex. How he fetched up there I don’t know but it seems the Viscount was displeased by the young Fawkes and soon dismissed him.
    Fawkes must have maintained contact with the family for he was subsequently employed by Anthony-Maria Browne, who went on to become the 2nd Viscount of Montagu in 1592. The Browne family had purchased Battle Abbey (founded by William the Conqueror) after the Dissolution of the Monasteries, as William had established the Abbey with 3 miles of estate surrounding the Battlefield. Consequently it was one of the richest Church properties, a prize plum for one of Henry VIII's favourite courtiers. It's rumoured that he was sent in to see Ann of Cleves on her arrival in England. He apparently came back to Henry and said "She's not like her portrait." Henry couldn't risk divorcing her, as she was powerfully connected to the few Protestant nations in Europe standing against the might of Catholic Spain and France, so set her up in Lewes.
    So there's a lot of connections to Sussex and the Gunpowder Plot.
    In fact it is rumoured that the gunpowder was suspected of having been produced in Battle.

    So, it's thanks to Sussex you can have fireworks and bonefires as poor old Guy Fawkes was caught before he could set the gunpowder off..... 1604 or 2019.... bit too early?
     
  5. CL1

    CL1 116th LAA and 92nd (Loyals) LAA,Royal Artillery

    "Remember remember the fifth of November
    Gunpowder, treason and plot.
    I see no reason why gunpowder, treason
    Should ever be forgot..."


     
  6. Owen

    Owen -- --- -.. MOD

    wish people would remember fireworks are for the 5th not any bloody night. heard loads this evening.

    edit: we had loads go off the other night just before 2am when the clocks went back.
     
    Last edited: Oct 31, 2020
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  7. Deacs

    Deacs Well i am from Cumbria.

    I agree Owen our poor laal dog is petrified she doesn't know what to do the poor laal thing.
     
  8. Grasmere

    Grasmere Well-Known Member

    The actor Kit Harington starred in and produced an excellent BBC series, Gunpowder (2017), which told the story of one of his ancestors, Robert Catesby, the leader of the conspirators of the Gunpowder Plot. Interestingly, through the other side of his family, he is also related to Lord Harington, who was in the Houses of Parliament when the attempt to blow them up was made in 1605.
     
  9. minden1759

    minden1759 Senior Member

    Guy Fawkes is an old boy of St Peter’s School in York. Founded AD 627.

    The school celebrates Bonfire Night but, in the interests of good taste towards an old boy, does not place an efficacy on top. How civilised!

    Regards

    Frank
     
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  10. Shiny 9th

    Shiny 9th Member

    I can remember vast bonfires piled high with wood and anything burnable in my childhood many aeons ago. One spectacular involved a whole piano which was pushed over onto its back playing a plaintiff last chord as the flames engulfed all working parts. The morning after was filled with an acrid burnt gunpowder smell and the haze from a thousands of family back garden displays provided the background for the start of fog. Naughty boys threw firecrackers.Putting a banger in a keyhole and running away was a favourite trick too. It must have caused damage to our lungs but at the time no one bothered as there was so much nicotine around inside our own homes!
     
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  11. TTH

    TTH Senior Member

    "Who says Orientals have no sense of humor? We invented gunpowder."----Detective Nick Yamana (Jack Soo), Barney Miller
     
  12. CL1

    CL1 116th LAA and 92nd (Loyals) LAA,Royal Artillery

    On the night of 4th/5th November 1605, Guy Fawkes was caught with thirty-six barrels of gunpowder in the cellars beneath Westminster. The idea was to blow up the House of Lords at the opening of Parliament on the 5th November, and to assassinate King James I.
    Although the plot happened in the Stuart period, in the reign of King James I, it actually had its origins in Elizabeth’s reign. Elizabeth had continued the work of Henry VIII, and Edward VI and made England a Protestant country. By the end of her reign, England was a dangerous place for Catholics, with the threat of persecution and even death hanging over them. As Elizabeth’s health deteriorated, the Catholics pinned their hopes on James VI of Scotland, who was married to a Catholic, and who was the son of the late Catholic queen, Mary, Queen of Scots. Although he himself was a Protestant, the Catholics felt sure that he would be sympathetic to their cause.

    James VI of Scotland became James I of England in 1603, on Elizabeth’s death, and although his reign started well for the Catholics, with James limiting the restrictions on Catholics, things took a turn for the worse when, after opposition from Protestants, James reversed his policy less than a year after implementing it. The Catholics’ hopes were dashed and they felt betrayed. One party of young Catholics, headed by Robert Catesby, a popular and rebellious young man at court, decided to seek revenge through rebellion. They met in London in May 1604 and hatched a plan to blow up the Palace of Westminster on the opening session of Parliament, thus killing the King, the Royal family, members of Parliament (MPs), the Lords and the leading bishops. This would be the first step in their rebellion which sought to replace James I with his daughter, nine year-old Princess Elizabeth, as a Catholic queen.
    One of the plotters, Thomas Percy, a member of the King’s Bodyguard, was able to lease lodgings that were situated adjacent to the House of Lords, and the idea was that the plotters would dig down underneath the foundations of the House of Lords and place gunpowder there. Guy Fawkes (also known as Guido Fawkes), a man who had been fighting for the Spanish in the Low Countries, was the man chosen to put the plan into operation by preparing the gunpowder and lighting the fuse, and he posed as Percy’s servant, calling himself John Johnson so that he could stay in the property.

    The Black Plague of summer 1604 meant that the plan had to be changed due to the opening of Parliament being delayed. However, this delay worked in the mens’ favour because during this time, they learned of a vacant ground-floor undercroft directly under the House of Lords Chamber. Thomas Percy was able to secure the lease of this undercroft. Guy Fawkes and other members of the group set about filling this space with 36 barrels of gunpowder, which had the potential to completely level the Palace of Westminster.

    Everything seemed fine, and the plot looked as if it would be successful, until Lord Monteagle received an anonymous tip-off just over a week before the state opening of Parliament was due to take place. The letter, thought to be from Lord Monteagle’s brother-in-law, Sir Francis Tresham, who had recently become a member of the plot, gave enough details for Lord Monteagle to go to Robert Cecil. Cecil took the news to the King, who ordered the cellars beneath Westminster to be searched. It was on the night of the 4th/5th November that Guy Fawkes was found red-handed with the evidence – 36 barrels of gunpowder!
    Guy Fawkes was arrested and tortured for information, but despite this failure, Catesby still attempted to incite armed rebellion in the Midland. It, too, was a failure and Catesby, along with a few of his co-conspirators, was killed in a shoot-out on 8th November. Those who weren’t killed were arrested, tried and then hanged, drawn and quartered in January 1606.

    On 5th November 1605, Londoners were encouraged to celebrate the King’s narrow escape by lighting bonfires around the city, and it is that celebration that is remembered in the UK every year on 5th November, along with the fireworks which have their origins in Guy Fawkes’ gunpowder. In fact, this celebration to give thanks for the deliverance of the King was made compulsory in the United Kingdom until 1859.

    The traditional rhyme which is said on Guy Fawkes Night is:

    Remember, remember the Fifth of November,
    The Gunpowder Treason and Plot,
    I know of no reason
    Why the Gunpowder Treason
    Should ever be forgot.

    Guy Fawkes, Guy Fawkes, t’was his intent
    To blow up the King and Parli’ment.
    Three-score barrels of powder below
    To prove old England’s overthrow;

    By God’s providence he was catch’d
    With a dark lantern and burning match.
    Holloa boys, holloa boys, let the bells ring.
    Holloa boys, holloa boys, God save the King!

    5th November 1605 - The Gunpowder Plot - The Tudor Society
     
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  13. Sheldrake

    Sheldrake All over the place....

    In Lewes they burn an effigy of the Pope .



    while Belfast is in a different time zone, wind your watch back 300 years

     
  14. CL1

    CL1 116th LAA and 92nd (Loyals) LAA,Royal Artillery

    Remember, Remember the Fifth of November


    Bonfire Night 5th November
     
  15. CL1

    CL1 116th LAA and 92nd (Loyals) LAA,Royal Artillery

    Great Lives - The Gunpowder Plotters

    Before we go any further, it is perhaps important to clarify what we mean by Great Lives for this week's edition.

    The word 'great' has many meanings. By strict definition, it means large, significant or important. Colloquially, it is commonly used as an expression of approval, for something or someone that we consider to be good. That is definitely not the case here.

    Robert Catesby, Stephen Littleton, Thomas Percy and their friends are "great" in the sense that they played a significant role in the history of the nation, and this region in particular. But they were certainly not good. However appealing it may sound at times, blowing up the Houses of Parliament is definitely something that is rightly frowned upon by right-thinking members of society.

    We are, of course, talking about the Gunpowder Plotters, who made their final stand in the heart of the West Midlands.
     
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  16. Wobbler

    Wobbler Well-Known Member

    I was just reading your post of last year Clive, in particular where you say the delay in 1604 worked in the plotters’ favour. It’s a curious “what if” isn’t it, actually. I know we don’t like what ifs, but I hope it’s ok in this case, as it certainly made me think (which is an increasing rarity these days).

    The delay certainly worked in their favour in terms of better premises from which to launch the attack, but had there been no delay in 1604, would Tresham ever have become involved? He appears to have been let in on the plot very late in 1605 and only then, from what I just read, after the death of his father, assuming that the death had any influence on the decision to then include him in the villainy, of course.

    So no Tresham, if he was the anonymous tipster, no letter, no discovery of the plan? Fascinating to wonder about but it didn’t happen that way so…
     
  17. CL1

    CL1 116th LAA and 92nd (Loyals) LAA,Royal Artillery

  18. ritsonvaljos

    ritsonvaljos Senior Member

    Are there many young kids who ask, "Penny for the Guy" nowadays?
     
  19. Owen

    Owen -- --- -.. MOD

    I thought there was a cost of living crisis.
    Not going by the sound a small war going on out there tonight.
     
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  20. CL1

    CL1 116th LAA and 92nd (Loyals) LAA,Royal Artillery

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