Italy Star Entitlement? Thomas John Conway, 3962234, Royal Sigs

Discussion in 'Service Records' started by GPMB, Feb 27, 2020.

  1. GPMB

    GPMB Member

    Following on from a suggestion from the Welcome forum, I am hoping someone may be able to help me out pls.

    I am currently looking into both of my great uncles who served in WW2 &Thomas Conway, as per his service records was awarded the Africa Star (with 1st Army Clasp), 39-45 Star, DM, WM but the most confusing is his entitlement to the Italy Star.

    I have attached his records & hope someone can shed some light please? I see he was awarded the Africa Star on 24.2.44 as part of the 46th Div & also says the Italy was awarded on 11.8.45 as part of 5 Med regt.

    I cannot see anywhere within the records of when he actually went to Italy (well not obvious anyway). His Military History Sheet states Home, Embodied(?), N Africa & Home. Nothing jumps out anywhere in his records that include Italy?

    Thoroughly confused.........
     

    Attached Files:

  2. Tricky Dicky

    Tricky Dicky Don'tre member

    I read he was awarded the Africa Star with 1st Army clasp - I dont see an Italy Star awarded but then I cannot zoom in to read some of the details, his records seem to show him based in North Africa

    Medals: campaigns, descriptions and eligibility

    The Italy Star is awarded for operational service in Sicily or Italy between 11 July 1943 and 8 May 1945. Those who served in Yugoslavia, Greece, Corsica or Sardinia between certain other specified dates will also qualify.
    To apply for the Italy Star, you must have:
    1 day of operational service in the army in the above qualifying areas
    1 day of operational service as ground crew in the RAF in the above qualifying areas
    1 operational sortie as aircrew in the RAF in the above qualifying areas
    1 day afloat on operational service in the above qualifying areas in the Royal Navy and already qualified for the 1939 to 1945 Star
    The colours of the ribbon represent the national colours of Italy.

    The Africa Star is awarded to personnel who served in North Africa, Malta or Egypt between 10 June 1940 and 12 May 1943.
    To apply for the Africa Star, you must have:
    1 day of operational service in the army in the above qualifying areas
    1 day of operational service as ground crew in the RAF in the above qualifying areas
    1 operational sortie as aircrew in the RAF in the above qualifying areas
    1 day afloat in the Mediterranean in the Royal Navy
    The colours of the ribbon symbolise the desert and the 3 services.

    Africa Star - Wikipedia
    The 1st Army Clasp was awarded for service with the First Army between 8 November 1942 and 12 May 1943 inclusive. An Arabic numeral "1" is worn on the ribbon bar in undress to denote the award of this clasp.[3]


    TD
     
  3. bamboo43

    bamboo43 Very Senior Member

    The 5th Medium Regiment RA definitely fought in the Italian Campaign, they landed at Salerno on the 9th September 1943.
     
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  4. GPMB

    GPMB Member

    Sorry - didnt realise you couldnt zoom in.

    Here is a close up......
     

    Attached Files:

  5. Tricky Dicky

    Tricky Dicky Don'tre member

    Ah OK

    Africa Star - awarded 29 1 1944
    1st Army Clasp - awarded 15 11 1944
    1939 - 1945 Star - awarded 4 3 1946
    Italy Star - awarded 4 3 1946
    Defence Medal

    That what I read

    TD
     
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  6. Tullybrone

    Tullybrone Senior Member

    Hi,

    The record seems to be one of those that has been imprecisely updated by the busy Army clerks after he went overseas.

    BNAF = British North Africa Force (originally applied to 1st Army but applied to troops who served in Algeria & Tunisia (occupying force, newly arrived reinforcements en route to Italy plus sick & injured evacuated for treatment/convalescence pending repatriation to England or return to a fighting unit in Italy) after the invasion of Sicily & mainland Italy.

    Clerks often failed to update a man’s onward posting from BNAF.

    There can be a several more accurate abbreviations to cover service in Italy - Central Mediterranean Force or Allied Armies Italy are both used in that context.

    The CMF abbreviation on his B103 shows he was in Italy and in the absence of entries to the contrary (sickness etc) I’d suggest he arrived in Italy on the same date as the rest of his unit.

    Steve
     
    Last edited: Feb 27, 2020
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  7. GPMB

    GPMB Member

    Brilliant. thanks mate. I wasn't aware of that so will do some digging.
     
  8. GPMB

    GPMB Member

    I assumed that would be the case - it seemed strange that apart from the CMF abbreviation and the medal mention, the Italy element seems to have been mostly missed.
     
  9. Tricky Dicky

    Tricky Dicky Don'tre member

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  10. GPMB

    GPMB Member

  11. minden1759

    minden1759 Senior Member

    GPMB.

    5 Med Regt RA was part of 2 Army Group Royal Artillery (AGRA) - a collection of mostly Medium Regiments. Here is the orbat for 6 AGRA.

    upload_2020-2-27_17-39-28.png

    2 AGRA landed in support of US Fifth Army at Salerno on 9 Sep 43 and stayed with them until May 44 when they were switched to support the British Eighth Army at the Fourth Battle of Cassino.

    Regards

    Frank
     

    Attached Files:

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  12. GPMB

    GPMB Member

    That is great, thanks. Having looked at the record though, it shows that he embarked to North Africa on 3.1.43, followed by a few entries to Feb 44, which then jumps to him being awarded the first army clasp as part of the CMF prior to Feb 45...

    Shame that the records are a bit thing on some key entries.......
     
  13. GPMB

    GPMB Member

    Cheers Steve, that is really helpful. I didn't realise a lot of the above & has certainly answered a lot of lingering questions. I think I can just assume then that he stayed with 5th Med Reg from early 43 until late 45, due to the distinct lack of entries......
     
  14. Tricky Dicky

    Tricky Dicky Don'tre member

  15. minden1759

    minden1759 Senior Member

    GPMB.

    You are right. He stayed with 5 Med Regt RA throughout. I see that he was also a naughty boy during his time with that Regt!

    He contravened Section 40 of the Army Act 1881. Section 40 is in very wide terms:

    “Every person subject to military law who commits any of the following offences, that is to say,

    Is guilty of any act, conduct, disorder, or neglect, to the prejudice of good order and military discipline.

    Regards

    Frank
     
  16. GPMB

    GPMB Member

    Brilliant, thanks mate. It looks like I am now doing some digging on 5 Med Reg, off the back of your previous post mentioning the orbat for 6 AGRA.

    Shame the Section 40 is so broad and you can't pin it down - can't of been that bad as his discharge write-up was very favourable.
     
  17. GPMB

    GPMB Member

    only just realised you had included a link - thanks :)
     

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