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US firefighters shooting


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#1 Owen

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Posted 24 December 2012 - 06:44 PM

Yet another nutter with a gun fucking up some innocent peoples lives.

BBC News - US firefighters shot dead at blaze in Webster, New York
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#2 4jonboy

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Posted 24 December 2012 - 07:23 PM

Yup, totally agree Owen. Bloody senseless.
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#3 Deacs

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Posted 24 December 2012 - 08:03 PM

Absoloutely shocking.
My thoughts and prayers are with their familys and friends
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#4 Warlord

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Posted 24 December 2012 - 08:22 PM

This world is going to hell! Bl**dy maniacs are taking over.

Lads, regardless of your faith, I ask you, please, to do a little prayer, or at least have a couple of thoughts, for this world of ours. Signs of the times keep showing up all over, and it's up to us to stop the downslide.

May God give confort to the families of these innocent victims.
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#5 Mike L

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Posted 24 December 2012 - 09:10 PM

We have had our fair share of gun outrages but America takes it to a different level.
Shocking events.
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#6 geoff501

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Posted 24 December 2012 - 09:28 PM

We have had our fair share of gun outrages but America takes it to a different level.
Shocking events.


11,000 gun death a year. Just waiting for the NRA to propose arming fire-fighters. A very sick society.
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#7 canuck

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Posted 24 December 2012 - 10:04 PM

11,000 gun death a year. Just waiting for the NRA to propose arming fire-fighters. A very sick society.


Some very sick individuals. Americans, by and large, aren't much different than anyone else. Sure, they tend to wear the flag on their sleeve and are patriotic to a fault but they are also the most generous folks around. They, like us, are products of their history and the 2nd Amendment is one of those tightly held values for many Americans. Most will not compromise on personal freedom.
Through a Canadian or British lense, it looks like madness but it hadn't reached the intolerable stage for Americans yet or the laws would have changed. Sometimes you pay for your principles.
There will be many tragic funerals ahead before anything changes.
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#8 geoff501

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Posted 24 December 2012 - 11:31 PM

Americans, by and large, aren't much different than anyone else.


Number of guns per capita by country - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
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#9 Drew5233

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Posted 25 December 2012 - 12:04 AM

11,000 gun death a year. Just waiting for the NRA to propose arming fire-fighters. A very sick society.


And the Paramedics B)
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#10 Mike L

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Posted 25 December 2012 - 12:22 AM

Geoff, noticed your link is 'small arms'. What are the stats for auto, semi-auto and shotguns?
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#11 Slipdigit

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Posted 25 December 2012 - 12:34 AM

11,000 gun death a year. Just waiting for the NRA to propose arming fire-fighters. A very sick society.


I'm a volunteer firefighter in a rural area of the South.

What makes you think we aren't already armed? Depending on the location in our district, we are potentially 10-20 minutes from arrival of the deputies. The crack and meth heads don't really like us to drive up into their yards. They even put booby traps out to try to slow the police and others down.
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Warmest Regards,
Jeff


#12 TTH

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Posted 25 December 2012 - 01:03 AM

A very sick society.

Our total of homicides is indeed disgraceful, but "a very sick society" goes too far. I don't make such blanket condemnations of Britain when I read of something sick or crazy there. Please weigh your words more carefully.
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#13 Gage

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Posted 25 December 2012 - 11:55 AM

Not only are the future being murdered but now the heroes. My thoughts with the families.
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#14 Varasc

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Posted 25 December 2012 - 01:17 PM

I read about that on BBC... Incredible. My thoughts for their families.

I have no words, anyway I'm quite pleased to think that here it's sensibly harder to buy a weapon. And even in this way we often have deadly hunting accidents. I fully understand the American way of thinking, their constitution and sense of individual freedom to carry arms, but... These massacres will only lead to a terrified, more and more armed society.
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#15 geoff501

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Posted 25 December 2012 - 07:19 PM

Our total of homicides is indeed disgraceful, but "a very sick society" goes too far. I don't make such blanket condemnations of Britain when I read of something sick or crazy there. Please weigh your words more carefully.


We get one of these mass homicides every 5 - 10 years. You have one per month. I apologize for going too far with my words.
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#16 jacksun

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Posted 26 December 2012 - 12:19 AM

I simply can't imagine the number of incidents in the US that do not hit the mainstream, in your face every second press.

9,146 homicides with guns in 2009 in the US. That's 25+ gun deaths a day or 2.98 per 100k people. This doesn't include accidents or suicides. In Canada, 173 in 2009, 0.5 per 100k people, in the UK, 18 in 2009, 0.03 per 100k people, Australia, 30 in 2009 or 0.1 per 100k people, France 142 or 0.23 (2010), Germany, 188 or 0.2, Japan, 11.

Columbia is worse, as is Russia and Mexico.

Yep, I'd say they have a problem. Six times higher rate than Canada, and 99 times higher rate than the UK.

Guns in the United States: Facts, Figures and Firearm Law

If this hadn't involved firefighters it wouldn't have made the national news. Would have just been another wacko with a gun killing a few people. Press wouldn't have cared.

Thoughts go out to their families, may they rest in peace.

Wayne
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#17 canuck

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Posted 26 December 2012 - 05:59 AM

Our total of homicides is indeed disgraceful, but "a very sick society" goes too far. I don't make such blanket condemnations of Britain when I read of something sick or crazy there. Please weigh your words more carefully.


TTH is absolutely right.
Our U.S. cousins don't need me to defend them but the number of these mass homicides warrant critical attention but not a blanket condemnation. I'm the first to support the need for some reform of existing firearms laws, especially assault weapons, in the U.S. but this intensely debated subject has many complex facets. Clearly, those states with stronger guns laws display lower death rates but the American public, despite mass shootings, does not demonstrate, even now, any stronger desire to change firearms legislation.
Behind the large numbers, the preponderance of gun deaths in the U.S. are in the major urban centers and within the 17-24 male population. Most of whom have criminal records. The poorer, less advantaged areas of the U.S. face much higher risks and the entire problem reflects the same socio-economic issues which have been present in the U.S. for a long time. Blacks are grossly over represented in both victim and offender categories. Six to seven times more than than whites.

As seen in the various threads on this topic, many outside of the U.S. are virulently anti-gun and strongly influenced by a continuous political indoctrination against personal firearms ownership in their own countries. The U.K. and Canada are fairly typical. These same countries have much higher crime rates for assault, rape, break in-ins, drug offenses, etc.

We need some balance in these discussions. Does America have a problem? Absolutely! But they cannot be stereotyped as an irresponsible bunch of gun toting rednecks. That simply isn't true and I'm sure our U.S. forum members are more distressed by recent events than we'll ever know. I wish them the best of luck.

Edited by canuck, 28 December 2012 - 02:55 AM.

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