Jump to content


Photo
- - - - -

Waffen SS - Wiking - Germania Regiment


  • Please log in to reply
37 replies to this topic

#1 Rory

Rory

    Junior Member

  • Registered Users
  • PipPip
  • 21 posts

Posted 29 May 2009 - 06:00 PM

Hello all

Would the Mods redirect this post if it is in the wrong category.:)

I have been given a beautifully framed set of medals and other items by the son of a chap who was in the above Regiment on the Russian Front.

I don't have the first name (hoping that someone will be able to provide it) but Feldwebel Schuttler was awarded the Iron Cross 2nd and then 1st Class as well as the Wound Badge. I also have his armbands marked Wiking and Germania respectively.

With the lot came several books all of which are in German (mine is decidedly rusty) which makes reading difficult. His son says his dad is mentioned in one or more of the books but they don't have an Index or Reference section at the back.

Question is - can any one point me in the direction of where I can find out more about this soldier and what he got up to?

Regards

Rory
  • 1

#2 Korps Steiner

Korps Steiner

    Senior Member

  • Registered Users
  • 173 posts

Posted 29 May 2009 - 06:18 PM

Many books have been written about the Wiking Division although i'm not sure that i can remember one that concentrates on Germania alone.

His rank will not be Feldwebel but either SS Unterscharfuher or SS Oberscharfuhrer.

If you have been given them you have doine very well as the cuff titles alone are worth £2000.

Surely the son can tell you his fathers first name ????

If you can post some photos and give the names of the books that would be helpful.
  • 0

Nikto ne Zabyt . Nichto ne Zabyto.

Let no one forget . Let nothing be forgotten.

 


#3 Drew5233

Drew5233

    Very Senior Member

  • Registered Users
  • 24,518 posts
  • LocationLeeds, West Yorkshire

Posted 29 May 2009 - 06:46 PM

Hi Rory,

Sounds like you've hit gold there and as KS say's some pictures would be great !

Here's a few SS-Wiking shots:

1.
Posted Image

3.
Posted Image
2.
Posted Image

4.
Posted Image

Some more shots below:
Search results for "bundesarchiv ss wiking" - Wikimedia Commons
  • 0

#4 Rory

Rory

    Junior Member

  • Registered Users
  • PipPip
  • 21 posts

Posted 29 May 2009 - 06:52 PM

Thank you for the reply Corps Steiner

I can get the chaps name from his son tomorrow - it would be impolite to rouse him at this hour in South Africa.

The books are:

Rollbahn in die Holle - Der wandernde Kessel von Tscherkassy - Korsun by Anton Ostry
Waffen SS in Einsatz by Paul Hausser
Division Das Reich 1934 -1939 by Weidinger and
Europaische Freiwillige - Die 5.SS Panzerdivision - Wiking.

There are also 2 large photo books (bild) covering the Regiment Germania and the Waffen SS in general.

I am amazed at what these things are worth!! I will try and post a photo tomorrow.

Regards

Rory
  • 0

#5 Rory

Rory

    Junior Member

  • Registered Users
  • PipPip
  • 21 posts

Posted 29 May 2009 - 07:05 PM

I had another look and the following books were also in the box:

- Wenn alle Bruder Schweigen - Grosser Bildband uber die Waffen SS
- Soldaten wie andere auch - Paul Hausser
- Division das Reich 1940-1941 - Otto Wendinger
- Panzer grenadiers - die Panzer Division "Wiking" im Bild

Regards

Rory

Edited by Rory, 29 May 2009 - 07:56 PM.

  • 0

#6 Ruimteaapje

Ruimteaapje

    Member

  • Registered Users
  • PipPipPip
  • 86 posts

Posted 29 May 2009 - 07:13 PM

If you have been given them you have doine very well as the cuff titles alone are worth £2000.

Be careful there. I know a lot of Leibstandarte veterans and many of them have a framed collection of awards, cufftitles and collartabs on their wall. BUT these are all post-war reproductions since they lost the originals following their surrender to the American army in May 1945. It is very likely that Wiking veterans also lost their original pieces when they became prisoners of war.
  • 0

#7 Rory

Rory

    Junior Member

  • Registered Users
  • PipPip
  • 21 posts

Posted 29 May 2009 - 07:16 PM

Herewith 2 photos. I apologise for the quality it is under artificial light.

Attached Files


Edited by Rory, 29 May 2009 - 07:55 PM.

  • 0

#8 Rory

Rory

    Junior Member

  • Registered Users
  • PipPip
  • 21 posts

Posted 30 May 2009 - 12:43 PM

I have spoken with the son. The soldiers names were Erich Justus Schuttler. Is there any one who knows where to find out more about him as POW ?

Regards

Rory
  • 0

#9 James S

James S

    Very Senior Member

  • Registered Users
  • 3,049 posts

Posted 30 May 2009 - 04:15 PM

When you look at Himmler it almost makes you sick , how he loved to play at soldiers.:mad:
  • 0

#10 Korps Steiner

Korps Steiner

    Senior Member

  • Registered Users
  • 173 posts

Posted 30 May 2009 - 09:50 PM

Hi Rory,

Thanks for the additional info and the photos looks like a nice set including his HIAG Badge. Nice set of books as well , i';ll do some research on him and come back to you,

regards

Paul
  • 0

Nikto ne Zabyt . Nichto ne Zabyto.

Let no one forget . Let nothing be forgotten.

 


#11 Steve G

Steve G

    Senior Member

  • Registered Users
  • 654 posts

Posted 30 May 2009 - 11:04 PM

When you look at Himmler it almost makes you sick , how he loved to play at soldiers.:mad:



Chicken Farmer, so I'm given to believe? Staggering, isn't it? Mind you, James, my work has taught me one thing; Chickens and Rats are just about inseparable! Seems par for the course then?

What I'd like to know is who the people in the third photo are. The happy smile on that girls face?

Maybe the lack of armed guards means they really are innocent souls, being guided out of a combat zone? It's just that I find so little record of civilians, meeting with the SS, ending up smiling.
  • 0

#12 Za Rodinu

Za Rodinu

    Supository of all wisdom

  • Registered Users
  • 6,514 posts
  • LocationIn a hole, and digging :D

Posted 31 May 2009 - 04:24 AM

I say, you are being offensive to rats!

Posted Image
  • 0

Quote from US Army field sanitation manual, 1850: "Dig the latrines downstream from the camp. The coffee tastes better."


#13 Rory

Rory

    Junior Member

  • Registered Users
  • PipPip
  • 21 posts

Posted 24 June 2009 - 12:38 PM

Hi all

I have now obtained a photo album of Schuttler.

Please refer to the attached - he was wounded outside Moscow on 17 February 1944 - what was the action that was taking place on that day?

Also, could someone confirm what his rank was from the insignia on his uniform.

Regards

Rory

Attached Files


  • 0

#14 Gerard

Gerard

    Seelow/Prora

  • Registered Users
  • 4,743 posts

Posted 24 June 2009 - 12:47 PM

Rory, this is all fabulous stuff and well done for posting. Two things strike me about these posts:

1. Drews photos - That Self-propelled gun. anyone have any info on it. That looks like a Tiger Chassis that its on (but given that I'm no tank expert I may well be wrong!!)

2. Rory, as regards Schuttler being wounded outside Moscow on 17th February 1944,The Germans had long left the area around Moscow at this time. In 1943 for example the line was nearer Smolensk which is about 360 kms or so from Moscow. I'd check the references for that piece of info for that looks to be wrong.
  • 0
"The Eastern front is like a house of cards. If the front is broken through at one point all the rest will collapse."
- General Heinz Guderian

Lead Singer with PROUDFOOT

#15 von Poop

von Poop

    Adaministrator

  • Idi Admin
  • 12,096 posts
  • LocationThe Abbey of Thelema

Posted 24 June 2009 - 01:48 PM

Rank looks like Oberscharfuhrer.

Both SPATGs appear to be variants of the LaS 762 (SdKfz.132 - Captured Soviet guns mounted on Pz.II chassis).
  • 0

Cake?


#16 Gerard

Gerard

    Seelow/Prora

  • Registered Users
  • 4,743 posts

Posted 24 June 2009 - 02:04 PM


Both SPATGs appear to be variants of the LaS 762 (SdKfz.132 - Captured Soviet guns mounted on Pz.II chassis).

Pz II Chassis? Dear God how wrong could I be????? :lol: Right, back to the books for me!!
  • -1
"The Eastern front is like a house of cards. If the front is broken through at one point all the rest will collapse."
- General Heinz Guderian

Lead Singer with PROUDFOOT

#17 Smudger Jnr

Smudger Jnr

    Our Man in Berlin

  • Registered Users
  • 9,174 posts
  • LocationBerlin, Germany.

Posted 24 June 2009 - 02:08 PM

Adam,

Spot on with the rank. Equivalent to a Heers Feldwebel.

Regards
Tom
  • 0
Reconnaissance Corps - Only the enemy in front.

#18 Rory

Rory

    Junior Member

  • Registered Users
  • PipPip
  • 21 posts

Posted 24 June 2009 - 02:22 PM

Thank you all for the heads up on the rank. Here is another photo of Schuttler with other medals etc. adorning his tunic.

Rory

Attached Files


  • 0

#19 Smudger Jnr

Smudger Jnr

    Our Man in Berlin

  • Registered Users
  • 9,174 posts
  • LocationBerlin, Germany.

Posted 24 June 2009 - 02:30 PM

Rory looks to be 1st and 2nd Class Iron Crosses.

Regards
Tom
  • 0
Reconnaissance Corps - Only the enemy in front.

#20 Drew5233

Drew5233

    Very Senior Member

  • Registered Users
  • 24,518 posts
  • LocationLeeds, West Yorkshire

Posted 24 June 2009 - 02:56 PM

Hi Rory,

Many thanks for posting the pictures-I bet he could tell a tale or two if he was still around today.

What an interesting thread this is turning into !

Cheers
Andy
  • 0

#21 Stig O'Tracy

Stig O'Tracy

    Senior Member

  • Registered Users
  • 358 posts

Posted 24 June 2009 - 03:19 PM

Given that this fellow managed to retain his cuff bands, medals and badges, I wonder if he managed to avoid capture at the end of the war, perhaps by posing as a civilian or perhaps he was wounded and was recuperating in a hospital somewhere safe.
  • 0

#22 Rory

Rory

    Junior Member

  • Registered Users
  • PipPip
  • 21 posts

Posted 24 June 2009 - 05:18 PM

According to his son from whom I acquired the medals and photo album his dad was initially taken prisoner in the American Sector but escaped. From there he returned home to Kassel where he got employment as a truck driver only to be grassed by his Onkel Augustus. This led to his rearrest and return to POW camp.

I assume that he left his cuff bands, medals etc. at home when he first escaped.

The photo album is great as he chronicled his entire life from the time he was joined the Jungvolk in 1933 right to when he was stationed in Holland, where he met and married his wife during the occupation, to when he was on the Russian Front, wounded in the shoulder and in hospital. It moves to when he was a POW and when the war was over to when he emigrated to South Africa in 1953. All of this in pictorial representation! Quite amazing.

Regards

Rory
  • 0

#23 von Poop

von Poop

    Adaministrator

  • Idi Admin
  • 12,096 posts
  • LocationThe Abbey of Thelema

Posted 24 June 2009 - 05:28 PM

What's the 'Coin' in the medal box Rory? (lower left)
Any chance of a close-up.

~A
  • 0

Cake?


#24 Rory

Rory

    Junior Member

  • Registered Users
  • PipPip
  • 21 posts

Posted 24 June 2009 - 05:43 PM

It is a medallion with the bust of a man and the following words etched on the side,

'Generaloberst der Waffen SS Paul Hauser 1880 - 1972'

Regards

Rory
  • 0

#25 von Poop

von Poop

    Adaministrator

  • Idi Admin
  • 12,096 posts
  • LocationThe Abbey of Thelema

Posted 24 June 2009 - 06:04 PM

I thought it looked like 'Papa' Hausser.
Presumably a memorial medallion (?), as he was such a leading light for SS veterans postwar.
Thousands attended his funeral in '72.
  • 0

Cake?


#26 Bodston

Bodston

    Little Willy

  • Registered Users
  • 2,176 posts

Posted 24 June 2009 - 06:31 PM

Pz II Chassis? Dear God how wrong could I be????? :lol: Right, back to the books for me!!


Marder II.
Chapter and verse by messrs. Chamberlain and Ellis

Posted Image
  • 0
My mother told me, I never should, play with the gypsies in the wood.

#27 Korps Steiner

Korps Steiner

    Senior Member

  • Registered Users
  • 173 posts

Posted 24 June 2009 - 08:12 PM

Rory,

Unfortunately i haven't come up with any info on him as an individual.

In February 1944 Wiking was surrounded in the Cherkassy pocket where he was wounded , the breakout from the pocket began on 16th Feb so he must have been wounded during the breakout.

regards

Paul
  • 0

Nikto ne Zabyt . Nichto ne Zabyto.

Let no one forget . Let nothing be forgotten.

 


#28 Korps Steiner

Korps Steiner

    Senior Member

  • Registered Users
  • 173 posts

Posted 24 June 2009 - 08:25 PM

Rory,

Unfortunately i haven't come up with any info on him as an individual.

In February 1944 Wiking was surrounded in the Cherkassy pocket where he was wounded , the breakout from the pocket began on 16th Feb so he must have been wounded during the breakout.

regards

Paul


At this time Germania was commanded by SS Obersturmbannfuhrer Hans Dorr a Swords winner and highly respected commander who was KIA on 17/4/1945.
  • 0

Nikto ne Zabyt . Nichto ne Zabyto.

Let no one forget . Let nothing be forgotten.

 


#29 Owen

Owen

    Immoderator

  • Super Moderators
  • 18,114 posts
  • LocationUnder the stairs

Posted 24 June 2009 - 09:52 PM

Very interesting thread.
Interesting to read about someone fron the 'other side'.
I hope people can keep their comments to helping Rory with his research, cheers.
  • 0

If you have any questions about the forum don't ask me, ask Adam - von Poop


#30 Rory

Rory

    Junior Member

  • Registered Users
  • PipPip
  • 21 posts

Posted 27 June 2009 - 07:09 AM

Paul

You are quite right. Schuttler was wounded on 17 Fevruary during the break out. An account of the action is given on pages 116 - 125 of Paul Hausser's book "Meine Ehre Heisst Treue"

Schuttler featured in this passage apparantly as the wounded Feldwebel! Unfortunately it has been a while since I read German so am battling to get the gist of it but it seems that they were confronted by a number of T34 tanks before they made their weary way to the relative safety of their lines.

Regards

Rory
  • 0




0 user(s) are reading this topic

0 members, 0 guests, 0 anonymous users